Do you ever feel gyped when you buy a used CD that ends up being a promotional CD? The music is the same and all, but I made an effort to buy the damn CD, and it turns out to be just as illegal as something I would have downloaded on Slsk. That's not cool.

Jizztards.

I've got loads of these.

I don't feel gyped because often if you look through second hand record store racks you can find promotional copies of albums that haven't even been released yet at half the price.

Plus they usually have the proper art work etc, so you gain on every count as far as I can see.

I've bought a lot of used CDs that were promos. It's kind of shitty, I guess. Even major retail chains sell them in used bins. How come the RIAA isn't cracking down on that?

Of course I've knowingly bought them on several occasions because a cheap CD is a cheap CD.

Part of what annoys me is I get the feeling the art work might be different in the final product. Not that I sit and listen to music while staring at the artwork, but I like to look at it once or twice to see what the artist thought was a proper visual supplement to the music.

I just need something to complain about.



Didn't they want to crack down on all used CD sales? Or was that book publishers?

I don't know anything about that. Used CD and book sales still abound to my knowledge. Tower has scaled back their used CD section lately, but I though that was just because they were buying too much crap that they couldn't sell for $7.99.

edit: Yeah, I guess they made a half-assed effort at cracking down a while ago, but retailers resisted. Selling promos is different anyway. What the hell are people supposed to with them? Return them to the label? Throw them away?

Because they'd be cracking down on people in the industry that sell back their promos. It's the consumers they hate.

Probably 1/4th of my collection is promos that I got used or legitimately and I have saved a small fortune.

Come and get me coppers.

Same here, but I'd say "saved a large fortune."

but I'm not gonna get sued for having a promo...so, as long as all the artwork and everything is there, it doesn't matter to me

I'm not sure it's illegal -- used is used. They're selling them on the second-hand market, and they are, indeed, second-hand. I think what they're not allowed to do is sell them as new.

Stone?

Well, what's I see as being uncool about it is that someone's making money selling it. It's the principle, dudes.

Then how did I end up with a promo copy of 'electro-shock blues'? I bought it the first week it was out, at Atomic, from the new cd bin.

Did I get gyped*?

... Oh, hell, send 'em all back to South Asia.

*One of the few colloquialisms I find offensive.

I think this is correct. I also always figured the promotional copies were only off limits before the CD is released. The record store I go to gets tons of these that they put at a listening station so you can listen to what's coming out soon. After the CDs are released, the promotional copies end up in the used rack.

It is my understanding that it is illegal to sell a promo copy because they often claim it as a copy belonging to the record company that is out on loan for promotional playing. If a record store sells it instead of a new copy, the label is out the profit. The store and consumer make out, but the band and label just gave away free product. I think it says something on most of them that it must be returned to the label whenever they come for it. They can come to my house and get it if they want it that bad.

Interestingly enough, a lot of the record labels give those extra promo copies to local used music stores. At least, they do here in LA.

It's not illegal. It's not even illegal for the guy or girl who got it to sell it.

The label is not making any money on the sale of a used CD...Nor is the artist getting thier royalty or a cut of their publishing for the sale of a used CD....It cannot be legal.....Unfort, i can not explain the tons of used CD stores that are not being invaded and closed down......but im willing to bet that it is frowned upon and not legal.

Is this a joke? Are you trying to say that selling a used car is illegal too? Because you can't differentiate between selling one item used and selling another item used. "Promo copies" is another issue, and I don't know the legality of that, but I know that if something is bought, it can also be sold by the owner again.

Yeah, seriously. In the case of a used CD, the artist, label, etc. already got paid from the initial sale. They don't deserve a royalty cut every time the item changes hands, and I'm pretty sure they have no legal right to, anymore than clothing designers deserve royalties from a sweater you bought at a thrift store.

My wording was wrong and I apologise.....I just spoke to my friend at Universal and posed the scenario to him....

There are alot of label / record store compromises that go on and that is a much deepr convo then what we are talking about here, but pays an affect...

BUt he said, in terms of a label sending a promotional CD to a record store, and them turning around and selling it,..that is frowned upon generally.....but is accepted because of many other reasons.....

In terms, of a record store selling a used CD, that was originally purchased...He said it was severely frowned upon, but not illegal....Of course the label would rather have a kid buy a brand new copy so they get paid and ther aritst gets paid, then buying a used copy....

Theres alot more involved....but i was wrong in how i presented it....im clearer now.

the lables don't care about promo CD's because they don't pay for them, artists do. Then the label gets a tax cut on making them and then probably some cash when they wholesale boxes of them to used CD dealers. So the lable makes a profit just for making them and the artists pay for the whole ordeal as part of their marketing budget.

there's lots of articles about this scam the label pulls, i'll try and find one.

Being 'out profit' is not a reason for something to be illegal. If I don't buy a new copy of the CD because it is crap, then they're out profit, too, but they can bite me.

That said, there is a difference between a used car and perhaps other used items. Say, for example, software -- software is licensed to you, not just sold. I believe CD's are closer to the car than to software, but there is still a certain amount of licensing going on, since the CD contains 'intellectual property'. It is not legal to rip the CD, then resell it and keep the rip.

You're entirely correct, but the assumption when you sell a CD or software is that you also sell your license to whoever buys it, not just the disc and accompanying artwork. Which means that, as soon as you pass the license on to the next person, you lose your right to use the music you may have ripped from the CD or the software that's installed on your computer. I think this is the confusing aspect for most people - they don't realize that when they "buy" a CD they don't own anything but the right to listen to it and the medium on which it's presented to them (and NOT the music,) and that "right" is provided via the license agreement that is printed somewhere on the disc or artwork.

And for the record, I'm not saying that I've never kept a copy of a good song from a crappy album that I've sold back or given to someone else. I don't have enough room to store tons of CDs kept only for one or two songs.

The thing about used promo copies is that there are countless examples in my collection where I've bought a promo of something I was unsure of, loved it, and wound up buying the rest of the artist's catalog, going to shows, etc. I may never have gotten into these artists without the introduction provided by a cheap used promo copy. My guess is the labels, evil greedy bastards they are, realize this and see, at least right now, no reason to go after shops for selling their promos.

And, hey, if the record store is supposed to have a promo copy of an album, why do I always see them getting multiples of these promos (I'm talking about in shipping boxes from the label, not turned in used)? They only need one to keep in-store to play whenever, not 10. If there wasn't an intent for stores to put these things out for sale, why wouldn't they send only one copy?

i feel the same way, g. i hate getting them. and i always felt awful about selling them. i don't anymore -- the last time i sold one, it was the advance for the new cardigans album. on amazon, they were going for, like $25. i couldn't bring myself to sell it for that, so i got rid of it for $5. the guy wrote me a note saying thanks. i reminded him that it was a promo. he's like, i don't give a crap, marry me. i was all like, whatever.

happy to say now i'm $5 richer and married.

++++++++++++

the label generally reads: For promotional use only. Sale or other transfer is prohibited. Must be returned on demand of recording company.

but if its just got a black mark across the bar code, or cut on the bottom, that's more of a wink to the record store or buyer that it was a promo. no instructions of the nature above.