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 Post subject: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 5:40 am 
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first I wanted to put this into the metal thread but that only has 5 readers.
I listened to the new mastodon (thanks, d) and I think this could be a nice ground for a discussion about dumbness in the music business.

I'm glad that I didn't expect a thing of the new mastodon, this is trite radio rock shit par excellence. what went wrong after blood mountain?

maybe this is an educational problem of some bands. they start furious, gain attention, earn money with it, and from this point everything else is out of focus. art turns into an illusionary vehicle for a usual 9-5 job, for the opportunity in buying useless shit and hitting wifes, neighbors or critics.

what's the aim of a band like mastodon? I mean, do they want to become the most successful rock band in history with selling the most albums? why can't they just focus on putting out good albums and forget about the money? this should not sound bitter at all, I actually don't feel really involved in that because a) I like their first couple of albums and b) I know enough bands that seem to keep creativity alive without any compromises with the mainstream customer.

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:40 am 
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Differences in sound can often be accredited to the producer, and they picked a guy whose resumé includes Eminem/Dre, Fiona Apple, and Mavis Staples. I don't know if this interview with Troy enlightens or confuses, but it seemed relevant to the topic.

Having only heard previews of each track on Amazon, I wonder if you're letting "Curl of the Burl" and "Creature Lives" (admittedly both duds) color your opinion of the rest of the album. I'm open to the idea that money/attenion have affected Mastodon, and I won't argue that this album is on par with their previous work. I don't just see how most of the album can be viewed as a sellout compared to "Colony of Birchmen."


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 7:20 am 
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I don't think they are really "good" enough to really sell out like mainstream hardrock bands. o just get the impression that they actually would like to sell as much as the mentioned, without getting "too cheesy".
though all this sounds pretty calculating, and it's a really funny sidenote that they 'chose' the producer who remixed the Jon Brion-version of Fiona Apple's album. Sony veto'd because Brions version was too weird and not mainstream enough. (it's way better than the later released version).

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:01 am 
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Serious head injuries do lead to significant changes in personality and may alter a person's outlook on life and/or priorities.

Quote:
In the Studio: Head Injury Inspires New Melodic Mastodon Album

By DAVID PEISNER
OCTOBER 7, 2008 11:37 AM ET
Mastodon can trace the origins of their fourth album to the pavement in front of the Mandalay Bay casino in Las Vegas. That's where the Atlanta metal band's guitarist-vocalist, Brent Hinds, was attacked and cracked his head open during a drunken altercation following the MTV VMAs in September 2007. Hinds suffered brain hemorrhaging, and then, as he recovered, he was plagued by vertigo.

"I was dizzy for eight months," he says, hanging out at a studio in the band's hometown, along with guitarist Bill Kelliher, bassist-vocalist Troy Sanders and drummer Brann Dailor. "During those months, I just sat with my acoustic and a little marijuana, and wrote all the music. I wanted a more melodic, easy-listening situation, and that definitely came from having head trauma."

Mastodon's last set, 2006's Blood Mountain, was their major-label debut, and it brought them up from the metal underground to a wider audience, earning them a Grammy nomination and MTV spins for "Colony of Birchmen." The new album continues the trend. "We wanted to make something a little broader," says Dailor. "A classic-rock-sounding record."

Those impulses led Mastodon to producer Brendan O'Brien (Bruce Springsteen, Pearl Jam). They were initially introduced to O'Brien backstage at a Springsteen show by E Street Band drummer Max Weinberg, whose son is a Mastodon fan. "I asked Bruce, 'How was Brendan to work with?' " says Dailor. "He said, 'He's the only person I've ever trusted with my music.' I was like, 'Well, you're the Boss.'"

O'Brien brought a relaxed vibe to the studio and helped flesh out the album's classic-rock heart. "Quintessence" adds spacey washes of synthesizers and vocal harmonies to the brawny riffs and piercing guitar lines. The thrashing "Divinations" comes on like Master of Puppets-era Metallica, only with soaring vocals and a bright chorus, and "Oblivion" inserts a bluesy guitar solo into a sinister, multitempo, prog-metal epic.

The finished album will contain only seven songs, and, like previous Mastodon outings, will be a concept record. After past efforts focused on fire, water and earth, the new disc will explore air, ghosts and the ethereal world. The group has talked about eventually combining the releases into a box set called The Elements.

"Musically and lyrically, this is the record we'd be writing if we weren't going to exist tomorrow," says Sanders. "We don't feel like we have to do a certain type of record to please a certain group. We're free to change."

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:38 am 
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A head injury, huh? Well I guess it all makes sense now.

Crack the Skye was such a big letdown for me. I loved and still love Leviathan (I have the picture disc vinyl!), and Blood Mountain was great. But then... there is a pretty clear linear progression from the gritty heaviness of Remission to the lite prog metal of Crack the Skye. You can blame the company they've kept, increased fame and success, a head injury, or whatever, but this is the direction they've been heading in. I haven't heard the new one, but I trust berliner's assessment. It certainly isn't surprising, but it sucks that they've gone even further down this path into bland, cheesy, slick, modern radio-friendly hard rock.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:17 am 
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I haven't heard the new album yet, but I seriously doubt Mastodon is making a calculated move to the mainstream to try to get rich. I think bands just get bored and try different things. It's probably an ego trip on some level, but I doubt it is completely about money. I suspect Mastodon were doing pretty well with their traditional fanbase, and they could've had a long, successful career touring and churning out different versions of Leviathan for decades.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:21 am 
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Most bands begin to 'mellow' or get safe as they get older.They have been around for a while. I'm sure most of em may have families at this point.....Can't cater to the 'underground' forever. time to make a good living at doing this, or getting real jobs.

one stream in and I'm digging it.

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:35 am 
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Yeah I don't really think it's a calculated move towards the mainstream either, and I wouldn't want them churning out "multiple versions of Leviathan forever". But there are a lot of different ways they could have gone. I had no problem with Blood Mountain. Their new direction just just isn't good. True, most bands mellow with age, but that's kind of why most people - or at least those that know the earlier stuff - don't really care about their later work.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:53 am 
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el_scorcho Wrote:
I haven't heard the new album yet, but I seriously doubt Mastodon is making a calculated move to the mainstream to try to get rich. I think bands just get bored and try different things. It's probably an ego trip on some level, but I doubt it is completely about money. I suspect Mastodon were doing pretty well with their traditional fanbase, and they could've had a long, successful career touring and churning out different versions of Leviathan for decades.


I still think: it's calculated. and what I meant above is that they seem to be not smart enough to do it good.
it's definitely not about recording the same album over and over, for me it's all about progression. mellowing down and writing stereotypy songs is a change or something that happens over time with some bands but this has to make sense in an artistic way. otherwise it's just to broaden the response on the market of buying listeners.

the story about this head injury is so Hollywood, I'm getting headaches from this myself. it's a weird image of a creative band, when they proclaim to be not fixed on something. this might be even true, but the result is something without any edges, without any of their sparkling and powerful ideas of the first albums.

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:35 pm 
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Mike Elizondo, the producer of The Hunter, has worked mainly in the pop and rap world and is a staff producer at WMG/Reprise and apparently had been wanting to work with Mastodon for a while?

http://read.mtvhive.com/2011/05/20/excl ... -elizondo/
http://allmusic.com/artist/mike-elizond ... 14/credits
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/m ... bros-69943

Quote:
“A few people had recommended him, and said he’d been asking about working with us,” Dailor says. “He’d been asking to work with us since before Blood Mountain came out. We learned he was this old thrash metal kid from L.A., and he totally got the band and understood what we were trying to do.”

While some longtime fans might wince at Elizondo’s pop leaning résumé, Dailor stresses that this isn’t really a new direction for the band. Though it’s not the long-awaited “Air” record (Mastodon’s first three albums featured fire, water, and earth elemental themes), Dailor confirms it’s still the same band.

“Everything still sounds like Mastodon,” he says. “There’s no way around that. We wanted to flip it upside down and get away from all the emotionally heavy subject matter. Crack the Skye was such a departure, but we learned a lot about ourselves from that. We’re taking those sensibilities and using them with more upbeat, loud and crazy riffage.”

Though Dailor was mum about the details of the tracks, he did reveal that new song titles include “Blasteroids” and “All the Heavy Lifting.”

“There’s some stuff on the new one that I feel like is totally different for us, and will surprise everybody,” he adds. “Maybe in a good way or maybe in a bad way, but everything that’s on there is stuff that we really love.”


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:43 pm 
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So I listened to some of that stream stu posted in the 2011 thread... it actually sounds alright to me. Maybe I'm just expecting a different animal now than when I listened to Crack the Skye, but this didn't strike me as too "nu-metal" or too mainstream hard rock. It actually sounds a little punchier than their last one, but this is only based on partial listens to the first few tracks.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:46 pm 
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I had that same head injury 2 years ago (or something very similar if not exactly as bad) and I didn't make me want to write music. It made me want to sit up in bed with 4 pillows behind me, drink beer slowly, watch Lost and not change the orientation of my skull for ANY GODDAMN REASON no matter what. If I moved my head at anything faster than a glacial pace I got helicopter spins and had to grab something and just hang on til it died down.

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:47 pm 
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while i do dig some of the melodic bits and songs on this new album, i have to wonder....'where the fuck is the heaviness?' they used to be this mammoth, powerful band, and now a lot of their sound is this annoying riffing, radio friendly guitar tones, and powerless vocals. i don't even really see it as getting mellow, but just losing what made them a great band in the beginning. heavy, monumental riffs and songs.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:49 pm 
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Drinky Wrote:
So I listened to some of that stream stu posted in the 2011 thread... it actually sounds alright to me. Maybe I'm just expecting a different animal now than when I listened to Crack the Skye, but this didn't strike me as too "nu-metal" or too mainstream hard rock. It actually sounds a little punchier than their last one, but this is only based on partial listens to the first few tracks.


the production is appropriately slicker considering the producer and the major label. Sounds sort of like Deftones at times? My reference point for slick-production hard rock/metal doesn't go much further than Tool's post 1996 output and Metallica's Black Album.

FWIW, I really dug Crack The Skye.

considering my 2011 music listening attention span, I don't see myself listening to The Hunter more than a few times.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:51 pm 
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for anyone interested in listening along, here is the new album...

Code:
http://www.mediafire.com/?cbi62ji3zmq3egd


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:53 pm 
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discostu Wrote:
Drinky Wrote:
So I listened to some of that stream stu posted in the 2011 thread... it actually sounds alright to me. Maybe I'm just expecting a different animal now than when I listened to Crack the Skye, but this didn't strike me as too "nu-metal" or too mainstream hard rock. It actually sounds a little punchier than their last one, but this is only based on partial listens to the first few tracks.


the production is appropriately slicker considering the producer and the major label. Sounds sort of like Deftones at times? My reference point for slick-production hard rock/metal doesn't go much further than Tool's post 1996 output and Metallica's Black Album.

FWIW, I really dug Crack The Skye.

considering my 2011 music listening attention span, I don't see myself listening to The Hunter more than a few times.



Dalen Wrote:
while i do dig some of the melodic bits and songs on this new album, i have to wonder....'where the fuck is the heaviness?' they used to be this mammoth, powerful band, and now a lot of their sound is this annoying riffing, radio friendly guitar tones, and powerless vocals. i don't even really see it as getting mellow, but just losing what made them a great band in the beginning. heavy, monumental riffs and songs.


I just so happened to be listening to "Spectrelight" right as I read this. There's your heavy. Here it is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffWVlG8r ... ge#t=2471s


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 2:54 pm 
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one heavy song an album really doesn't impress me.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 3:47 pm 
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Haven't heard the new one, but like Drinky liked Remission and Leviathan. Blood Mountain was ok, but I never really bought into the hype that surrounded it. Listened to Crack The Skye a few times and just didn't click with it. Decided I wasn't going to spend time with the new one based on that. Pretty much ok with just digging on their first two records and leaving it at that.

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 5:56 pm 
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Nah, I see this as a function of the type metal that berliner and Dale listen to today. From observation, I see a leaning to black/death metal. Dale has repeatedly demonstrated his love of Sabbath/Slayer. I, on the other hand, grew up on Zep, Van Halen, Motley Crue, and eventually Metallica and Megadeth. Never had the desire to submerge in Black Sabbath, Slayer, Ozzy. I like clean vocals as opposed to someone croaking about Satan, mostly unintelligibly, over heavy riffs that I may like or not. I've enjoyed the entire career trajectory of Mastodon, this release included. Another of those "to each his own" things, I guess. Or maybe I'm completely missing berliner's point.

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:20 pm 
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Wow, that post makes it sound like you've really never heard Black Sabbath. Like, at all.


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:42 pm 
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Drinky Wrote:
Wow, that post makes it sound like you've really never heard Black Sabbath. Like, at all.

I've definitely heard them. And I have much more of an appreciation for them now than I did then. They just weren't what was pumping on my stereo (home and truck) in my late teens/early 20's in the heavy department.

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Cotton Wrote:
I'd probably just drink myself to death. More so, I mean.


"Hey Judas. I know you've made a grave mistake.
Hey Peter. You've been pretty sweet since Easter break."


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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:33 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 12:34 am 
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Crack the Skye was my favorite Mastodon album and I'm really enjoying the new one a lot

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 Post subject: Re: mastodon is ridiculous.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 5:22 am 
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discostu Wrote:
FWIW, I really dug Crack The Skye.

My #1 of '09. Blood Mountain is my point-of-entry, and I've also enjoyed the proggy shift they've made.


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