Right. The water on this issue is too muddy from too many dirty hands and feet. I'm not sure you can provide an completely true and accurate account of the entire even. It's also very easy to attribute sloppy investigations and dumb spur of the moment decisions to cover-ups and wide reaching conspiracies.

Would it benefit me to know for certain if George Bush knew ahead of time about what was planned for 9/11 and had the power to stop it?

I'm not a fan of Bush, but gimme a damn break. It's not even about love of country, but moreso human nature. It's like the nuts who believe the moon landing was fake. How in the hell do you keep all those mouths shut?

You sir, are mentally ill if you really think that that is possible.

Especially when that damn song is played on some radio station, somewhere, every minute of the day.

Michael Stipe is a worse provocateur than Michael Moore.

That might be the single most depressing post I've ever read on this board. It seems to me that the American public's acceptance to shrug and "move on" from this event has effected the country profoundly - from the large scale cynicism towards what WAS an honorable political process to the small scale loss of personal accountability.


Haq be wise. And that last statement is loaded.

The Kennedy assasination is just the left side bookend (Watergate is the right side) of the collection of novels that is Vietnam and you can trace the cynicism, the rise of conservatism, and the decline of America as a global power right there.

I don't for a second think that Bush had any idea of the scale and tragedy of what was to happen.

But you know what - when it comes to that man, and the people who surround him and have his ear, almost nothing would shock me. It's obvious that human lives (American or otherwise) mean very little to them in the course of obtaining their goals.

I find it amazing that the anti-Bush crowd claims George Bush is not only too stupid to make velcro stay put, but he is also capable of executing and concealing plans that would make Lex Luthor cringe.

Explain.

I think Bush is more of a puppet. A tool. He is weak, plyable, and that is just the type of president that those with the real power wanted.

Hey! I didnt say that!

BTW is Cheney Cobra Commander or Destro?

Condi is definitely The Baroness [img][290:500]http://img325.imageshack.us/img325/3384/cobrabaroness4if.jpg[/img]

Then explain
A: Who are those with "real power"
B: How is it obvious that American lives mean little to "them"
C: What are "their" real goals?

Just curious: Have you ever read any transcripts of Bush or gotten any information about him that didnt come from MoveOn.org or AirAmerica?

God, I hate when I have to spend part of my day defending someone I didnt even vote for.....

A. big corporations
B. Iraq death count
C. to make money

http://www.dispatch.co.za/2005/10/27/Fo ... erica.html

http://www.iraqbodycount.org/

Destro had heart and much love for his beloved Baroness. Maybe Cheney's Major Bludd?

I suppose you would have me getting all my information from CNN and FOX?

The Economist, people.

Read that shee'.

How original. I'm not pro-Bush or pro-Iraq War, but let's just say on the longshot that in 10 years we have no American troops in a democratic Republic of Iraq and more transparency and democratization of the regimes in Syria, Iran, Lebanon, Egypt and Saudi Arabia.

What would your view be then?

My view would be the same. You are assuming that the military action is about aid and establishing democracy. I don't believe that it is. I believe that is just a nice little spin that makes the whole debacle more palatable to the American people.

Are you asking me "What if the world was just one big happy ball of wax with no dictators or oppression and had no need for world policing, whether it be by the USA or the UN or whoever?"

Here, let's keep backing you into your open-minded and informed little corner.

Let's not only assume first hypothetical situation with democracy and transparency in the Middle East, but also that we allowed total local rule of the oil fields and made all US corporations move out? Would you still think you were right?

Not necessarily. I said before, I am not pro-Iraq War. But, even though I don't think it's a good idea for us to noodle in another regions cultural and political landscape, that does not render any positive outcomes invalid.

I am far from informed.

Which point, specifically, are you asking me if I feel I would be right about?

Nor does it make any deaths less pointless or painful.