cause the israeli army went into a synagogue and forcibly removed a bunch of jewish protesters kicking and screaming. i cant say i have much sympathy for their cause, not when most of the country supports the pullout from gaza.

I'm more concerned with all of the planes that are falling out of the sky.

Yeah there was the one in Venezuela the following day of the Greek flight. Crappy.

Now I'm even more afraid to fly. ugh

Personally (and as a Jew, myself), I think it's a great move for Israel to pull out of Gaza.

The only way that peace will be achieved is by BOTH SIDES admitting that the other has a right to exist. And while this is only a first step, it is an important one, both politically and symbolically. And is a CONCRETE concession and a very REAL step toward helping to establish a Palestenian state.

The ball is now in the Palestinean's court.
But there will always be hardliners on both sides, and they will be the one who will throw a wrench into the whole process.

What Todd said.

those settlers have some real balls/are really insane.

Where God promises you something, you got a pretty good racket there.

Cause you can just fall back on "but God gave it to me" no matter what.

I also think that it might not be a bad idea to establish Jereusalem as a soverign city/state.

It would be a tough sell to the Jews (who seem to have the strongest claim on the area). But that city is so important to THREE major religions that it probably SHOULD be free from rule under any one of the sects.

IMO, anyone settling & fighting over arid, rocky land all in the name of religion has a touch of the insane.

Jesus, are guys monitoring my instant messages now; Text of actual convo between me and LooGar this AM:

DiamondaveS500: what do you take from this israel thing?
geneskinner93: shit
geneskinner93: i actually need to catch up on the latest
DiamondaveS500: they movin folks out
geneskinner93: i think ive been going "ignorance is bliss"
geneskinner93: yeah
geneskinner93: i know
geneskinner93: i was not happy that Netanyahu quit the cabinet
DiamondaveS500: it's weird. if you truly believe that God gave you that land....
geneskinner93: i like him
geneskinner93: better than Sharon
DiamondaveS500: on the other hand, do we really think these S grade terrorists are gonna be happy with gaza?
geneskinner93: no
DiamondaveS500: they kinda do need their own country
DiamondaveS500: cos if they livein israel proper, as real citizens, they gonna be majority pop in like 10 years
DiamondaveS500: thenw hat?
geneskinner93: the palestinans are the worst----they have no economy and no marketable skills, 65% unemployment
geneskinner93: i agree
geneskinner93: give 'em their own state; only problem is they then become Jordan's defacto welfare state
geneskinner93: or they still have to go into Israel to work
DiamondaveS500: as long as they don't blow shit up, let em
DiamondaveS500: they need em like we need mexes
geneskinner93: the Palestinans are not the Persians, or the Saudi's
geneskinner93: they have no desire to work or make money
geneskinner93: they fuck and complain, fuck and complain
geneskinner93: i hate them
geneskinner93: i hate the fucking
geneskinner93: Saudis but i respect them
geneskinner93: the palestenians are worthless
DiamondaveS500: and stinky
geneskinner93: blech *spits*

This probably will only be a short-term peace with palestinians. Some history:

Ariel Sharon was the General during the 6-day war in 1967 that pushed Eygpt back to Suez Canal, thus securing the Sinia penninsula and the Gaza strip. Also, Israel gained control of the West Bank (Which is much larger and infinitely more valuable) from Palestinian Authority (read Jordan) during this same war by conquering Syria and Kingdom of Jordan and pushing them back to the Jordan River. Israel views these territories as buffers between arab nations that have been attacking them since the inception of israel. Since aquiring both of these territories Ariel Sharon has been pushing for Israel to settle in these to show that Israel has no intention of giving them back. Israel has been in a constant state of war with the PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization) since 1967. Now as you have probably read, Ariel Sharon has no plans to give up any more territory in the West Bank (he gave up 4 settlements this week) and in fact, he is building a wall around East Jerusalem (what palestinians consider to be there capital) to further secure it. I have a strong feeling that until Sharon gives up the West Bank, the PLO will continue to terrorize Israel.

I think Sharon gave up the Gaza for two main reasons, the first is to buy time to build up the West Bank and the second is to secure Israel's future. The Gaza had 1.4 million palestians living in it under Israel control and it's thought that by 2025, there would be more Palestinians in Israel than Israelis, so to secure Israel's future, Sharon is backing out of Gaza now.

edit: Also, it should be noted that Sinai peninsula was given back to Eygpt in 1978ish.

I don't think it would do much good. Everything is about religion there. Being soverign only allows Muslims a chance to cause more conflict in an already sensitive area in my opinion. Muslims and Jews both want religious states instead of secular ones. I think we 'westernize" this complicated issue sometimes.

Moreover I don't know if joint recognition really matters. I think for a significant majority the violence only ends when the Jews leave the middle east completely, and after looking at the history of the Jews, one can see why they no longer fuck around, and throw their force around whenever possible.

I actually think that a lot of this whole thing has more to do with economics than religion.

They are some pretty tough mofo's. They've pretty much kicked the crap out of every arab nation that has attacked them. Also, it's really interesting to read about how the US has become so involved in middle eastern affairs and why muslims hate us (which basically started through arm sales to israel back in the late 40's and early 50's) and wound up with us supplying weapons to both Iraq and Iran during the Iraq-Iran War. I bet the US defense corporations looked at middle east as a cash cow for about 30 years.

Economics is always at the heart of every matter in some fashion.

Ya think? I'm sure in your own life, you've seen what a downturn in economics/employment can do to to people's sensibilities. Louisianna is like a fucking experiment on this.

That and losing your federal highway funding.

Absolutely right. Fucking yankees.

And you could feel a 500 page book on economics and religion and not even begin to cover the issues. No economical issues...No protestant reformation.

I respect any state that loses their highway funding because they refuse to raise the drinking age from 18. (of course they later relented)

With the current oil crisis, why are we not ressurecting the Texas oil fields? I know we do a lot of production in the Gulf (which is funny considering how many people get up in arms about drilling in ANWAR, I mean, I fish the Gulf every year and I'm only slightly mentally ill), but Shit.

Also, attn. GWB: release some oil from the salt mine reserves. Clinton did it and it actually helped the economy. I AM DYING OVER HERE FROM THESE GAS PRICES!!!