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 Post subject: NMR: Speaking truth to power; this absolutely made my day
PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:11 pm 
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I absolutely want to buy this man a beer.
And to cut the suspense, this is a video of man straightforwardly telling bush that he's a jackass at a rally in Charlotte yesterday. The white house has been trying to keep this from happening for years, and it finally did.
:rawk:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:18 pm 
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Wow. Bush's reaction is ridiculous. He's the president of the US and he cops an attitude like he's a kid that's just been caught doing something wrong. Yeah, this is the perfect time to make a joke, Mr. Pres.

I wonder if that audience member's going to mysteriously go missing in a day or so...

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:21 pm 
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actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:23 pm 
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oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


How so? He practically laughed at the guy. How did you think Bush would react?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:23 pm 
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oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


Same here.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:25 pm 
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red Wrote:
oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


How so? He practically laughed at the guy. How did you think Bush would react?


He answered his question, and stuck to his decision, while acknowledging that people don't always agree. He also quieted the crowd to allow the man to speak. What was he supposed to do? Throw up his hands and say, "Well fuck. Now I see what you guys have been talking about. My bad."

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:26 pm 
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Fu Wrote:
red Wrote:
oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


How so? He practically laughed at the guy. How did you think Bush would react?


He answered his question, and stuck to his decision, while acknowledging that people don't always agree. He also quieted the crowd to allow the man to speak. What was he supposed to do? Throw up his hands and say, "Well fuck. Now I see what you guys have been talking about. My bad."


Yeah, you're right. I guess his initial snortle at the guy made me a bit sour. Although your alternative reaction would've been pretty funny.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:27 pm 
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For the record, I don't agree with the administration position on this. Not one bit. But at least he didn't dodge the question, he just restated the same position pretty directly.

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Last edited by Elvis Fu on Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:27 pm 
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red Wrote:
oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


How so? He practically laughed at the guy. How did you think Bush would react?


I think he deflected the seriousness of the question with a joke. You might not like it but it was good move to make this guy look like your typical limp wristed tree hugger. Secondly he said, 'let the guy finish", which makes Bush look open to all view points. Then he finished by making a rational counterpoint to the man's argument on wiretapping. It was one of the better jobs I've seen of Bush taking criticism.

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I tried to find somebody of that sort that I could like that nobody else did - because everybody would adopt his group, and his group would be _it_; someone weird like Captain Beefheart. It's no different now - people trying to outdo ! each other in extremes. There are people who like X, and there are people who say X are wimps; they like Black Flag.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:28 pm 
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word.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:40 pm 
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oldbullee Wrote:
red Wrote:
oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


How so? He practically laughed at the guy. How did you think Bush would react?


I think he deflected the seriousness of the question with a joke. You might not like it but it was good move to make this guy look like your typical limp wristed tree hugger. Secondly he said, 'let the guy finish", which makes Bush look open to all view points. Then he finished by making a rational counterpoint to the man's argument on wiretapping. It was one of the better jobs I've seen of Bush taking criticism.


I agree that Bush handled himself well, but the fact this even happened is what makes me happy. Whitehouse staffers have done their best to prescreen audiences for these types of event for the entirety of Bush's term, so that this kind of thing would never happen. IMHO, the man you describe as a 'typical limp wristed tree hugger' was actually quite brave, made his points clearly and expressed his dissaproval of Bush's policies face to face with the most powerful man in the world. That takes some balls, and I think people in the audience would figure that out. And while Bush did present a lucid counter-argument (shock!), the argument is a loser to those who learn the facts about what's been going on. I bet more than a few people in that audience will be curious to find out what that man was so upset about. Also, this happened in Charlotte, North Carolina, which to the best of my knowledge, isn't that liberal. This is exactly the kind of place where things like this need to happen. I'm still pretty satisfied.

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Last edited by Mr. Mister on Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:44 pm 
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I'm with ya mister. All I am saying is Bush handled it well, which surprised me considering Bush's famed lack of public communication ability.

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I tried to find somebody of that sort that I could like that nobody else did - because everybody would adopt his group, and his group would be _it_; someone weird like Captain Beefheart. It's no different now - people trying to outdo ! each other in extremes. There are people who like X, and there are people who say X are wimps; they like Black Flag.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:46 pm 
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me too. very ballsy and i'm kind of impressed at how composed he was. to actually be addressing those thoughts to man himself takes some serious composure.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 1:49 pm 
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Fu Wrote:
oldbullee Wrote:
actually, I thought Bush handled himself surprisingly well.


Same here.


i had the same reaction. i was really impressed that he said 'quiet, let him speak." and then he gave a very measured, good response. very much the opposite of what we've been led to believe (even by him) that his impromptu speaking is like.

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His name was Jun. Disillusioned she tried to forget.
She left everything and traveled to the other world.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 5:17 pm 
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um, bump.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 7:24 pm 
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I still want to see the debate between Bush & Ann Richards in 1994. I've heard from a pretty wide variety of sources that Bush not only outdueled Richards, an accomplished debator, but he also had almost little resemblance to his current public speaking deameanor.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 9:12 pm 
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Bush did his job fine, and the questioner did his job as a citizen extraordinarily well. Only the citizen gets my beer, but that's politics for you.


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 Post subject: Re: NMR: Speaking truth to power; this absolutely made my day
PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:35 pm 
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Props to the citizen who got to say things the president rarely hears during his screened town hall meetings.

Yeah, Bush didn't fumble around, but it's the same tired bullshit we've been hearing for months now. Even worse than the wiretapping is the fact that habeas corpus is effectively dead in the United States following 9/11 and neither party seems to care that the president can strip any citizen of their civil rights indefinitely at any time.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:41 pm 
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Like you can talk, Mr Military-Industrial Complex.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:42 pm 
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I think one of the failings of those opposed to an erosion of civil liberties is the tendency to blame Bush/Cheney/Gonzales (or any Democrat counterpart) out of convenience, rather than attacking bullshit policies, especially at the local level. I'm not faulting anyone in particular here.

I very anti-wiretapping, but it doesn't pose a fraction of the threat of No-Knock Raids local police have found to be so advantageous.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:56 pm 
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bluejayway Wrote:
Like you can talk, Mr Military-Industrial Complex.

give the guy a break. a guys gotta eat.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:58 pm 
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Aw, c'mon. He totally signed up for it. And he knows I'm just joshin'.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:01 pm 
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i mean, when im hungry i just dress up as mike krzyzewski and bite kids heads off, but that just doesnt work for everybody.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 9:32 am 
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Fu Wrote:
I think one of the failings of those opposed to an erosion of civil liberties is the tendency to blame Bush/Cheney/Gonzales (or any Democrat counterpart) out of convenience, rather than attacking bullshit policies, especially at the local level. I'm not faulting anyone in particular here.

I very anti-wiretapping, but it doesn't pose a fraction of the threat of No-Knock Raids local police have found to be so advantageous.


I alluded to something similar in that 9/11 thread..it is much easier to blame your problems on some nebulous vast conspiracy...

And while National politics is far sexier, local shit is where you can actually get some things done.

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