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 Post subject: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:43 am 
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I'm not as into modern jazz as I was a few years ago...but apparently there has been some dust-up over the usage of the word "jazz"? I didn't catch this blog posting, "An Open Letter To My Dissenters On Why Jazz Isn’t Cool Anymore", but it seemed to spawn a movement. Its now apparently racist to use the term jazz in reference to...well, jazz. It's now Black American Music...or BAM!, which had its first conference in January (Video Here)

So, it'll be interesting to see how this goes. Will the Grammy's now have a jazz category and a Black American Music category...or will it go the way of the Latin Grammys? How will the old guard adopt this? Are the Utah Jazz now as racially dividing as the Redskins? Interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:57 am 
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Interesting WSJ essay from a day or two ago: When 'Jazz' Was a Dirty Word

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:50 am 
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I don't dispute his premise outright that "jazz is dead" or ceased to be cool a long time ago or whatever but,

A. Renaming something is not going to suddenly make it relevant again.
B. "Black American Music" is a stupid fucking name.
C. Isn't renaming Jazz "Black American Music" patently offensive to other people who play other non-jazz styles of Black American Music (ie Blues, Soul, Hip Hop, Funk)?
D. I never thought of jazz as being a pseudonym for the n-word but I will take it under advisement

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:33 am 
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Is calling Pat Metheny's music jazz racist?

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 12:35 pm 
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The Dixieland Jazz Band was white.

Applying a race to jazz is stupid.


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 1:00 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 1:50 pm 
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Gayford R. Tincture

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What about other black Americans who make music? Like Kanye, TV on the Radio, The-Dream, Beyonce, Bad Brains, Killer Mike, Cee-Lo. Are they also making Black American Music?


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 1:51 pm 
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If you think the name "Jazz" marginalized and separated black music from the mainstream, how does it help to continue segregating the music you make by labeling it as "black music"?


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 2:09 pm 
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I actually really do make an effort to be sensitive to issues like this and to try as much as possible to not offend with my words in many of these situations. (personally anyway even though I do often find theoretical arguments on both sides interesting) But this can fuck right off. No way this catches on.


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:00 pm 
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Being 1/64th Walloon I'm offended by the term Black American Music and think any Jazz featuring the saxophone should be refered to as Belgian Instrument Music.

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:25 pm 
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wow, this is just plain RACIST!

http://jalc.org/

this is ridiculous


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:52 pm 
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The saxophone crack reminds me of having dinner with a black girl and a song came on in the background and she is all... "oh, I love this song." Then after a short pause, "I know, all you white people think black folks just love the saxophone."

And here I thought I knew all about all of the ways in which white folks stereotyped black people and I was missing this important one.

But seriously, has anyone ever heard of that as a stereotype? That just confused me.


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:14 pm 
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nobody Wrote:
The saxophone crack reminds me of having dinner with a black girl and a song came on in the background and she is all... "oh, I love this song." Then after a short pause, "I know, all you white people think black folks just love the saxophone."

And here I thought I knew all about all of the ways in which white folks stereotyped black people and I was missing this important one.

But seriously, has anyone ever heard of that as a stereotype? That just confused me.


One thing I do notice through work is that black people love I Can't Go For That by Hall & Oates and they go nuts when the sax solo comes in...

they also like Peter Gabriel and Phil Collins (but not Genesis)

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 8:59 pm 
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Sex, Drugs, and Dave Wrote:
nobody Wrote:
The saxophone crack reminds me of having dinner with a black girl and a song came on in the background and she is all... "oh, I love this song." Then after a short pause, "I know, all you white people think black folks just love the saxophone."

And here I thought I knew all about all of the ways in which white folks stereotyped black people and I was missing this important one.

But seriously, has anyone ever heard of that as a stereotype? That just confused me.


One thing I do notice through work is that black people love I Can't Go For That by Hall & Oates and they go nuts when the sax solo comes in...

they also like Peter Gabriel and Phil Collins (but not Genesis)


Black people like "In The Air Tonight" not Phil Collins. I've known this for approximately 25 years now since back to when my brother played high school football.

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:00 pm 
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Actually, shit more like 27 or 28 years.

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:09 pm 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
Sex, Drugs, and Dave Wrote:
nobody Wrote:
The saxophone crack reminds me of having dinner with a black girl and a song came on in the background and she is all... "oh, I love this song." Then after a short pause, "I know, all you white people think black folks just love the saxophone."

And here I thought I knew all about all of the ways in which white folks stereotyped black people and I was missing this important one.

But seriously, has anyone ever heard of that as a stereotype? That just confused me.


One thing I do notice through work is that black people love I Can't Go For That by Hall & Oates and they go nuts when the sax solo comes in...

they also like Peter Gabriel and Phil Collins (but not Genesis)


Black people like "In The Air Tonight" not Phil Collins. I've known this for approximately 25 years now since back to when my brother played high school football.


Tyson


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:17 pm 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
Sex, Drugs, and Dave Wrote:
nobody Wrote:
The saxophone crack reminds me of having dinner with a black girl and a song came on in the background and she is all... "oh, I love this song." Then after a short pause, "I know, all you white people think black folks just love the saxophone."

And here I thought I knew all about all of the ways in which white folks stereotyped black people and I was missing this important one.

But seriously, has anyone ever heard of that as a stereotype? That just confused me.


One thing I do notice through work is that black people love I Can't Go For That by Hall & Oates and they go nuts when the sax solo comes in...

they also like Peter Gabriel and Phil Collins (but not Genesis)


Black people like "In The Air Tonight" not Phil Collins. I've known this for approximately 25 years now since back to when my brother played high school football.


they also like Sussudio....

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:20 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:40 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:30 am 
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discostu Wrote:
wow, this is just plain RACIST!

http://jalc.org/

this is ridiculous


Might as well be a Klan meeting :nono:

Drinky Wrote:
If you think the name "Jazz" marginalized and separated black music from the mainstream, how does it help to continue segregating the music you make by labeling it as "black music"?


That was my thought as well.

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:25 am 
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there are lots of words that started as an insult and at some point lost the sting and then came to be embraced. Mormons no longer consider it an insult to be called Mormon, and most people don't realize it was ever an insult. Same with Quakers. And of course, same with Christians.

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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:56 am 
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Reading more, this looks to be an attempt to get more black folks back into Jazz, playing and listening. While I cant help but think this is a good goal to have, I also can't at all see how this name change is going to make the slightest bit of difference. I'm not saying I have an answer to that issue. But, changing a name everyone knows and identifies with the music to a somewhat silly sounding acronym cant possibly be the solution.


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 Post subject: Re: The J-word? Racist? What?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:40 am 
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Holy shit this was stupid.

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