I knew there was a reason I love Lennon...we have so much in common.

Seems you're going pretty far out of your way to make a point. McCartney's input was obviously valuable, but are you seriously contending that Lennon was just a lucky passenger on that particular bus? It's still not too late to backtrack.

Paul McCartney just needs someone to say "um NO, we are not doing that" The great thing about the Beatles is that no one person was them. It was a great balancing act between 4 people. Yeah I said it. They freakin' needed Ringo. Obviously not for creative reasons, but he was defintely a stablizing force within the band at times that they needed it most. They were the ultimate example of a sum of parts. The parts were great, but it worked best as a machine obviously. Even though Plastic Ono Band kicks serious ass.

Just saw this. No, never caught the Whigs live. Think they came across better live?

I was jsut taking my "afternoon constitutional" in the men's room & had these exact thoughts. Well put Bullee.

no backtracking necessary. actually oldbullee made half of my point for me. I just fucking hate the deification of John Lennon and I really hate what he let himself become. He failed himself on a LOT OF LEVELS.

This does not mean i dont like/respect/worship/idolise John Lennon; it just pisses me off to read first person accounts of the way that dde handled himself and when you read the studio notes from the later albums, it gets even worse.

I think Lennon gets so much deification because he's everything people want an artist to be. He puts himself out there for all to see. He's was troubled and difficult, but when he got it together it was fucking great. Paul's persona is the exact opposite which undercuts our perception of "artists".

He's no demi-god, I just really like that voice.

I do too. I am a huge fan of them all (ringo to a much lesser extent).

Lennon pretty much started the whole backlash against McCartney in interviews and songs before his death (obviously). However, I think in 2005, with all that shit put behind them, he would be the one person telling people who suggested McCartney didn't pull his weight to fuck off.

Steve

Defintely. Lennon acknowledged that Mac kept the whole thing going and was the driving force during his bad times with drugs. But I don't think you would ever get him to admit that it wasn't HIS band.

McCartney went on to write such awful songs as "Freedom" and "Simply Having a Wonderful Christmas Time" (I think that's the name of it). How is it that a guy that was such an important component of one of, if not the, most important bands in the world wrote those songs? Don't even get me started on "Silly Love Songs."

you should make me a mix of these and i'll send you my old school mix whenever i get around to finishing it.

it's a rotating cast of singers, actually. and none of them sound good. they're probably all friends and the guy just don't know how to say no.

you realize you guys are just begging for someone to go out and shoot/deify Macca now.

To say that any one of the Beatles was the Beatles is completely retarded (easily the twelfth time i've used this word today, bad). The Beatles were all four of them on many, many levels. songwriting, blah blah blah the two have very similar batting averages with me for different reasons. But regardless, the beauty of the Beatles to me wasn't the two singers, it was four distinct personalities interacting with each other and having little other than being in the Beatles in common by the end. Yeah, Ringo was a joke, but a necessary one.

Sure, Lennon was a dickhole who was self-absorbant and overly grandiose, and Paul was a control freak who alienated everyone else in the band. Harrison brooded all the time and Ringo is Ringo. C'est la vie. Either way, complaining about their catalogue is tantamount to my answer. you want every band to be better.

i knew darrin was going to answer "beta band" and that had to be my answer as well. i'm also a bit disappointed in "clinic." they have such potential, and "internal wrangler" is one of my favorites, but the last one was just so meh.

I guarantee you that you'll like the post-Illmatic Nas albums below. In fact, my friend likes It Was Written more than Illmatic. (I don't necessarily agree with him, but it's still a fantastic record). Although some of Nas's other albums were great, I'm not as confident in recommending them, not even Stillmatic. God's Son did everything Stillmatic was trying to do, but better. It felt more like a cohesive album and less like a (good) mixtape.

It Was Written
Lost Tapes
God's Son

Also, I Am is a personal favorite, but so many people disagree with me that I can't give it a straight endorsement.

I like the few songs I've heard off Nastrodoomus.

Some more than others.

first one that came to mind

yo la tengo

And, he died. Tragically.

That helps.

Death, they say, is the greatest career/legacy move.

(See also, Bill Mahr discussing the Doors/Morrison.)

I'll even admit, that they are 10x better live then on record, and I already think the records are brilliant....No better front man then Dulli.

Stars

true dat.