Zune

Mick · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:36 am

The Mayor of Simpleton Wrote:

fuse Wrote:

For you techie types:

How much longer can they increase hard drive capacity? So, 80 gigs now, I'd suspect 120 gigs down the road in 07.

Aren't we heading for a on-demand wireless subscription service eventually? And will it seem quaint that at one we were carrying around our entire music catalog?

Seems like apple is trotting out the gig increases before that game is made irrelevant.

I think that's probably where we're headed - XM/Sirius is the start and someday that'll be the norm, but they're going to have to figure out a way to beam on-deman content to every user at all times, which is going to involve nation-wide wifi before anything like that can occur. I think we'll see harddrives disappear to be replaced by huge amounts of RAM long before we get to wireless systems. That's just the next logical step - I mean, the Nano is already up to 8gb in RAM just a year after it came out, double what it was last year. Give it 5 years and these days of fragile spinning harddrives will seem like the Stone Age. I'd say it'll be 10 years before we're truly wireless with these things, however - not just because we can't get there faster but because it makes financial sense for these companies to stretch out the transition.

I don't think this will happen widescale, because there's always a hell of a lot of people like me who refuse to subscribe to things. I'm a one-off fee kinda guy.

Mick · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:42 am

also i think Apple should get more retro-compatible and shit with the iPod. My 60gb video is completely physically capable of doing everything the new 80 gb one can, but the recent driver update just gave me pretty little letters when i scroll and some vague new options, no search function or anything.

I really respect Nintendo as a company because with all their new products, they always make sure everything is backwards compatible with the older technology. It promotes loyalty. Like how the DS can play every handheld nintendo game from all the previous consoles.

Donovan · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:49 am

fuse Wrote:

For you techie types:

How much longer can they increase hard drive capacity? So, 80 gigs now, I'd suspect 120 gigs down the road in 07.

Aren't we heading for a on-demand wireless subscription service eventually? And will it seem quaint that at one we were carrying around our entire music catalog?

Seems like apple is trotting out the gig increases before that game is made irrelevant.

There are already services, like Orb, which let you stream your media to a portable device. It's not perfect, but as high-speed wireless networks come online it'll get better.

shmoo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:06 am

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

I really respect Nintendo as a company because with all their new products, they always make sure everything is backwards compatible with the older technology. It promotes loyalty. Like how the DS can play every handheld nintendo game from all the previous consoles.

Whoa, when did this start? I haven't been following lately but one of the reasons Nintendo lost to Sega and eventually Sony (ancient history, I know) was because their new systems were NOT backwards compatible. Not that Sega's were either at first, hence them losing to Sony as well.

HaqDiesel · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:23 am

shmoo Wrote:

I obviously wish it didn't have the DRM limitations, but obviously there's not much that Microsoft can do about that.

What? Why? If anyone in the whole electronics game can do something about it it's Microsoft. If you mean that it would be impolitical, then I guess that's true, but Apple has managed to stand up to the RIAA (albeit on pricing, not DRM) and they've had to take it. Since the advent of WMA, Microsoft has offered poor quality, highly restricted content delivery even though they COULD do something about it. This will be no different.

Mick · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:38 am

shmoo Wrote:

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

I really respect Nintendo as a company because with all their new products, they always make sure everything is backwards compatible with the older technology. It promotes loyalty. Like how the DS can play every handheld nintendo game from all the previous consoles.

Whoa, when did this start? I haven't been following lately but one of the reasons Nintendo lost to Sega and eventually Sony (ancient history, I know) was because their new systems were NOT backwards compatible. Not that Sega's were either at first, hence them losing to Sony as well.

it's been out for a while now. PLus the new flagship console, the Wii, is entirely backwards compatible and can play (through downloads) any game Nintendo, Atari, or Sega has ever released on any console, ever, barring some exceptions/

shmoo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 1:21 pm

HaqDiesel Wrote:

Microsoft has offered poor quality, highly restricted content delivery even though they COULD do something about it. This will be no different.

And Apple hasn't? The reason iTunes mp3s don't play are other mp3 players isn't a fault of the other players.

Neither company has removed DRM. If Apple hasn't done it, with the amount of money they're making for the record industry, there's no way Microsoft would do it without retaliation.

Also, pricing is different. The RIAA has no legal power to control prices (there was a whole lawsuit about that which netted me $13.86), but they do have the power to protect their copyrights.

shmoo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 1:22 pm

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

the Wii, is entirely backwards compatible and can play (through downloads) any game Nintendo, Atari, or Sega has ever released on any console, ever, barring some exceptions/

Well, so can my computer. That's not particularly special.

Totally Wired · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:21 pm

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

Like how the DS can play every handheld nintendo game from all the previous consoles.

Just to clarify, the DS broke backwards compatability with everything besdies GBA games. There's only so much hardware you can fit into a handheld to make backwards compatibility with all generations possible, and Nintendo saw it fit to finally cut off legacy software.

Dalen · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:31 pm

shmoo Wrote:

HaqDiesel Wrote:

Microsoft has offered poor quality, highly restricted content delivery even though they COULD do something about it. This will be no different.

And Apple hasn't? The reason iTunes mp3s don't play are other mp3 players isn't a fault of the other players.

Neither company has removed DRM. If Apple hasn't done it, with the amount of money they're making for the record industry, there's no way Microsoft would do it without retaliation.

exactly right.

legonads · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:11 pm

I guess it's also worth noting that the Zune will not play protected WMA files from services such as Napster and Rhapsody, so members of those existing services are screwed.

This has nothing to do with pressure from the RIAA. It's entirely Microsoft's choice to not give a shit about consumers.

shmoo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:16 pm

lego Wrote:

I guess it's also worth noting that the Zune will not play protected WMA files from services such as Napster and Rhapsody, so members of those existing services are screwed.

This has nothing to do with pressure from the RIAA. It's entirely Microsoft's choice to not give a shit about consumers.

Or Apple, Napster, and RealNetworks protecting their files so Microsoft can't legally use them (hence the word "protected"). One of the two.

legonads · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:33 pm

shmoo Wrote:

Or Apple, Napster, and RealNetworks protecting their files so Microsoft can't legally use them (hence the word "protected"). One of the two.

Doesn't Napster use Microsoft's DRM technology, making their files compatible on all PlayForSure devices? And RealNetworks has actually made efforts towards compatability with other devices, such as the iPod, a move which Apple was not too fond of.

But yes, Apple sucks too when it comes to offering consumers choice and compatability.

shmoo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:19 pm

Well, I don't really know much about this DRM stuff and your post was the first I'd heard about any problems with Rhapsody or Napster files actually.

The Mayor of Simpleton · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:59 pm

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

also i think Apple should get more retro-compatible and shit with the iPod. My 60gb video is completely physically capable of doing everything the new 80 gb one can, but the recent driver update just gave me pretty little letters when i scroll and some vague new options, no search function or anything.

Most of the new functions do work from what I read - games and the gapless feature work, and apparently the search function may require some new hardware combination (probably the chip) to function (or maybe it just hasn't been implemented correctly in the early 5G models.)

Think about it, however - what is the benefit to Apple right now to be "retro-compatible" with their Ipods? No one else needs to do that - you don't see car manufacturers offering special deals on the latest functions in 2007 cars for 2006 models, do you? Why would Apple?

The Mayor of Simpleton · **Posted:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:01 pm

lego Wrote:

shmoo Wrote:

Or Apple, Napster, and RealNetworks protecting their files so Microsoft can't legally use them (hence the word "protected"). One of the two.

Doesn't Napster use Microsoft's DRM technology, making their files compatible on all PlayForSure devices?

Yes, and Microsoft is setting up Zune with its own system and DRM that is incompatible - and stranding everyone on PlaysForSure (MS is basically cutting its ties to PFS.) I read an article that predicted PFS would be dead within a couple of years because of this, and that's exactly what MS wants - new customers for Zune. Might backfire and send them to Apple, however.

Atticus Finch · **Joined:** Sat Jun 03, 2006 2:18 pm **Posts:** 627

Dalen Wrote:

more info on Zune...

Very impressive bells and whistles compared to Apple's. (thanks for all the info.)
When this gadget is out in full gear I still anticipate lots of hits on Knowledge base and tech support..

pollysix · **Joined:** Tue Oct 26, 2004 2:56 am **Posts:** 5174

Dalen Wrote:

shmoo Wrote:

The wireless sharing is pretty cool.

hey shmoo, how is this going to work? will one be able to send files to a pc, or access files from a pc without being connected via USB? if so, that's rad.

My Palm TX can do that. Wireless or Bluetooth. But right now it's only as good as its memory cards for storage---i.e. 4gig. But then again it does all kinds of other nice things.

fuse · **Posted:** Fri Sep 22, 2006 10:38 am

For you marketing types:

Isn't November a little late to be rolling these things out for xmas sales? You'll get some tech-dork sales for sure, but there doesn't seem to be enough time to wage an effective campaign and make people turn from the ipod juggernaut in a matter of weeks.

The Mayor of Simpleton · **Posted:** Fri Sep 22, 2006 1:11 pm

pollysix Wrote:

Dalen Wrote:

shmoo Wrote:

The wireless sharing is pretty cool.

hey shmoo, how is this going to work? will one be able to send files to a pc, or access files from a pc without being connected via USB? if so, that's rad.

My Palm TX can do that. Wireless or Bluetooth. But right now it's only as good as its memory cards for storage---i.e. 4gig. But then again it does all kinds of other nice things.

I thought the deal was that the Zune could share songs between other Zunes - like you'd be in a library listening to yours and someone would "see" yours and find a song on yours and grab it from you, then get some short period of time to listen to it, at which point they were prompted to pay for it. A neat idea, but from what I read, that wireless sharing is going to eat batteries like crazy - I sure hope there's an option to turn that off.

Dick Meatwood · **Posted:** Fri Sep 22, 2006 1:45 pm

I thought "Zune" sounded like the name of some D&D-type character or the villain from some gay Saturday morning cartoon.

Sure enough:
[img][409:500]http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/872/zune046bc.jpg[/img]

Flying Rabbit · **Posted:** Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:15 pm

fuse Wrote:

For you marketing types:

Isn't November a little late to be rolling these things out for xmas sales? You'll get some tech-dork sales for sure, but there doesn't seem to be enough time to wage an effective campaign and make people turn from the ipod juggernaut in a matter of weeks.

Uh...Black Friday? Traditionally November is when things are released like video game systems, and tech stuff for holidays.

As for the Zune, I just feel that with all the other players out there now, why is this going to be so different? Maybe once they are in hand, but still it just seems to me that the specs are on average what everyone is going for, and the looks aren't impressive to me in the least.

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