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 Post subject: RIAA speaks about d'loading lawsuits (from Village Voice)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:49 pm 
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A long but interesting article from The Village Voice:

Meet John Doe: The RIAA runs its lawsuits as a volume business, and sometimes downloaders just gotta settle
by Nick Mamatas
March 7th, 2005 2:05 PM write to us


Of the millions of people who illegally download free music using various peer-to-peer (P2P) networks, only about 8,400 have been sued by the recording industry—including, last month, an 83-year-old dead woman from West Virginia. Those odds seem pretty good, until it happens to you. This past October, my former Internet provider alerted me that they had been subpoenaed by the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA) on behalf of its member labels with the demand to turn over the names and addresses of 100 "John Does" that the RIAA had detected sharing music. The RIAA is now appealing an 8th Circuit Court decision, which ruled that Internet services providers don't have to reveal names of customers who have not yet been sued.

"We surf peer-to-peer music networks," Jonathan Lamy of the RIAA communications office says. "We look for people who are offering songs, and if they have a substantial number of songs, we take note of all the songs they are offering for distribution and their IP addresses." Suits are filed against the anonymous file-sharers in bulk and then the RIAA goes to court to get names and addresses from ISPs. From there, the RIAA offers downloaders a chance to settle the complaint, or they can go to court and fight it.

For me, the experience of settling with the RIAA was almost painless—except for the thousands I agreed to pay. Dragging my "shared" folder to the trash icon, promising not to download anymore, and acknowledging that illegal downloading is wrongful were easy enough. I happened to know an intellectual-property lawyer who agreed to handle the negotiations pro bono. He was the one who called the RIAA settlement center number and spoke not to a lawyer, but to a staffer empowered and trained to negotiate. "It feels like they're doing a volume business," my lawyer told me.

Lamy says that of the 8,400 suits filed (8,100 of which were filed against John Does) there have been about 1,700 settlements to date. The process, from detection to settlement, can take months, but its critics believe the RIAA moves far too quickly. Annalee Newitz, policy analyst for the civil liberties group the Electronic Frontier Foundation, says the practice of suing not just a single anonymous person but dozens at a time is called "spamigation." "That's one of the slimier things that entertainment companies are doing," she says, because mass lawsuits allow "companies to sue hundreds of people for the same cost as suing only one. So instead of respecting the defendants' due process rights and suing them individually, the companies are able to cut down on court fees and sue them as a group. This makes it much easier for companies to sue people willy-nilly, even if they aren't sure that the person being sued is in fact infringing, because it doesn't cost them any extra money to add another name to their suit." The EFF has helped compel entertainment companies to file individual rather than group lawsuits in Northern California, and has also worked with other John Does to have the RIAA and other entertainment company cases moved to their home states.

Most settlements top $3,000, and according to Newitz, some can go as high as $7,000. The RIAA wouldn't confirm these figures, but it didn't dispute them either. Lamy says that of all the John Doe cases so far, "none have come to trial." And indeed, it is hard to imagine going to trial doing much good for a hypothetical Doe, since millions of users are illegally downloading and sharing music. Frequent downloader Cecilia Gonzalez didn't settle against the RIAA, and on January 7, she received only a summary judgment in a U.S. District Court. Throwing out Gonzalez's claims that she was simply "sampling" songs to see if she wished to buy them and that she was an "innocent infringer" unaware that she was violating record company copyrights, the court ordered her to pay damages of $750 for each of 30 songs she was found to have downloaded illegally, for a total of $22,500. That's more than the poverty line income for a family of five in 2004 ($22,030), but it is worth pointing out that damages of $750 per infringement is the minimum the RIAA could have received, and that the original complaint filed against Gonzalez claimed that she had nearly 2,500 downloaded songs. Damage payments could potentially be much higher. Finally, courts have found that the "cumulative effect" of downloaders makes individual downloaders liable for damages, even if their personal downloading has only a marginal impact, so even penny-ante downloaders are potentially at risk.

The RIAA is not eager to go to trial, according to Lamy. "We would prefer to settle sooner rather than later. . . . We make numerous attempts to engage downloaders throughout the process." The RIAA is even eager to adopt P2P technology, he says. "Record companies are aggressively licensing digital music," and even Napster founder Shawn Fanning has come in from the cold with SNOCAP, a clearinghouse of properly licensed digital music. The problem is that legal digital music firms have to compete against P2P outfits with "parasitical business models." It's cheaper to distribute stolen free stuff than it is to pay up front, after all.

For all the furor over the suits, they may not be having that much effect on the amount of illegal downloading. Newitz says that "recent reports indicate that file sharing is bigger than ever—and so are the record industry's profits. As a result, it's hard to see the suits as anything other than a wrongheaded attempt by the old media industry to push upstart innovators out of the marketplace rather than working with them." The RIAA points to the rise in legal downloading to show that its strategy is working. In a December press release, RIAA president Cary Sherman said, "With legal online retailers still forced to compete against illegal free networks, the playing field remains decidedly unbalanced. . . . That's why continued enforcement against individuals stealing and distributing music illegally is essential, as is holding accountable the businesses that intentionally promote and profit from this theft."

The EFF has its own suggested model for legal downloading, called "voluntary collective licensing." P2P users would pay a flat rate, say five dollars a month, for use of the networks, and that money would be passed on to ASCAP or some other suitable association representing artists and producers. "This is exactly how radio works, except that radio stations pay the licensing fees rather than listeners," Newitz says. "It would be easy to figure out how much to pay artists using a VCL for P2P technologies, because it's simple to use current software to track how many times a song is downloaded"—a method that would make such a scheme even more precise than the estimates radio uses. But the RIAA isn't going for it. "We do oppose compulsory licensing schemes that would set a specific price" for a license to download, says Lamy. SNOCAP and other pay-for-play systems like iTunes is what the industry supports.

And downloading? Well, I'm done with it now, except for legal amazon.com freebies, but even my close friends haven't been scared off. One scoffed at my settlement, and said that if she were sued, she'd fight the RIAA in court. For her, downloading is "civil disobedience" in protest against the legal digital music systems that just don't have all the music she wants. Of course it's easy to strike a rebel pose like that . . . until you become just another John Doe.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:09 pm 
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good article, i wish that this whole matter would just be settled. i guess that it's going to be like smoking weed, where everyone's doing it but it's illegal and once in a while someone's gotta get nicked.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:29 pm 
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chase Wrote:
good article, i wish that this whole matter would just be settled. i guess that it's going to be like smoking weed, where everyone's doing it but it's illegal and once in a while someone's gotta get nicked.


Excellent analogy. Your chance of getting hit are pretty low. Even lower when you consider they are probably still only hitting the big p2p that I never use (KaZaa, limewire, etc.)

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:50 pm 
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I really enjoyed the article from someone who actually has settled with the RIAA.

Question though, and perhaps this has been brought up before but--has anyone gone to court against the RIAA that had been sued and brought their entire record, cd, tape, MD, etc collection to the trial to prove that they are indeed substantial consumers of music? I'm no lawyer but wouldn't that be a good case against them if say someone like myself who owns in the 1000s now in music? Obviously I spend a substantial amount to my paltry dls. Of course being a former college music director helped :lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:53 pm 
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That wouldn't help. Doing lots of legal stuff doesn't give you license to do even a little illegal stuff.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:55 pm 
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what would they do if you could show that you had an unsecured wireless internet connection and that someone else had used it to d/l music? i don't think that your router stores a MAC address. would they try to get you for some kind of negligence, or is this just counting on you to settle before that happened?


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:58 pm 
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I think that if you could make a convincing case that that's what happened, you'd be off the hook. When people do illegal things while trespassing on your property, you're ordinarily not liable.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:30 pm 
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HaqDiesel Wrote:
I think that if you could make a convincing case that that's what happened, you'd be off the hook. When people do illegal things while trespassing on your property, you're ordinarily not liable.


Can't wait to start law school so I can explain things as well as Haq.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:36 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:38 pm 
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heres an article on slashdot the was posted yesterday about allofmp3.com. apparently russian copyright law doesnt cover stuff like legal, although pretty shady, downloading.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:47 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:57 pm 
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The idiots should go after everyone selling promos on Amazon, and then everyone who tapes crap off the radio. Pretty soon, they'll sue some dude for singing in the shower without licensing the material. All so the can afford to make more stitched-graphic varsity jackets for their retard promo reps.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:24 pm 
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I DL as much as the next guy, and maybe I am the minority, but ordinarily I do it becuase (to quote the once great William "Billy" Joel) "There's a new band in town/but you can't get the sound/from a story in a magazine" and often end up buying (amazon and itunes are my pushers) what I like. but rarely ever throw anything away... so what if:

If the RIAA had a giant site where I could DL a song or two from my artist of interest from them - give it a 5 times play limit, I don't care- then that's a problem solved, heck the could utilize the info gathered via the site to better serve their marketplace....and even save them m-o-n-e-y.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:31 pm 
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beachy lunchtime musings Wrote:
If the RIAA had a giant site where I could DL a song or two from my artist of interest from them - give it a 5 times play limit, I don't care- then that's a problem solved, heck the could utilize the info gathered via the site to better serve their marketplace....and even save them m-o-n-e-y.
good idea, but i think that what we're seeing is a desperation to have nothing about the business model change on the part of the RIAA.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:33 pm 
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beachy lunchtime musings Wrote:
I DL as much as the next guy, and maybe I am the minority, but ordinarily I do it becuase (to quote the once great William "Billy" Joel) "There's a new band in town/but you can't get the sound/from a story in a magazine" and often end up buying (amazon and itunes are my pushers) what I like. but rarely ever throw anything away... so what if:

If the RIAA had a giant site where I could DL a song or two from my artist of interest from them - give it a 5 times play limit, I don't care- then that's a problem solved, heck the could utilize the info gathered via the site to better serve their marketplace....and even save them m-o-n-e-y.


Silly, silly, silly. You've got an industry association that staffed primarily by lawyers and lobbyists. They don't give a rat's ass about the quality of their product. They couldn't care less how to serve you better. They're targeting those without the resources to fight them, and intimidating those targets into settling for thousands if that article is to be believed. At an average of $12 a pop, $3K buys 250 CD's. But it's cheaper than retaining a lawyer.

Home taping/burning, apparently is killing music after all.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 5:38 pm 
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Just wait til the greedy useless bastards get hip to our Mix Forum and communities like The Art Of The Mix.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:21 pm 
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You're right, it seems as if they would rather not reformat the business model, and that's patently the issue behind the litigation, but also.
It's ironic to see some 16yr old G-boy on MTV Cribs show off his three Hummers he can't drive yet, I think its great he's rich, rawk on, but to hear that the industry is withering on the vine... ? The big guy's profits are withering, not the industry.

I fully believe that the introduction of the net/ easier mass production of CDs/ other factors related to progress/tech in the hands of the "little guy" has made more and more music available to the masses. Used to be, the industry could give (and only spend the money on) 15 or so artists and say: Look, here's the music you can have, buy it now! The pie is the same, but the pieces are smaller for everyone, and for a bloated few, this is unacceptable. The easiest corporate answer is :twisted: litigation :twisted:
I'm not in the music business, but I am very interseted in this, so tell me.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:34 pm 
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I think it's stubborn pigheadedness on the part of the industry's leadership. Rather than answer the question, why are people downloading music, they'd rather focus on how to prevent it.

Edit: I also don't think there's an industry yet, that has survived/thrived by attacking its end-users i.e. customers.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:38 pm 
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I'm curious, if file sharing is illegal, how do libraries get away with distributing protected music for free?


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 9:10 pm 
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I have a question. Say the RIAA busted me for downloading. I really don't have internet access, a friend worked for one of the cable companies and hooked our house up for free. Could I claim that "Hey I don't have internet access." and get off since we really don't have an ISP and the account isn't registered to anyone in our house?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 12:17 am 
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Rick Derris Wrote:
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WTF? I've been freejacked!!

This reeks of the work of my nemesis........


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 1:34 am 
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How about the Obner DC hub - are us users at risk (can they see this kind of activity?) Or is the RIAA just peeking in on the typical P2P applications like Soulseek, Kazaa, etc? Anyone know if we should start expecting visits from the Music Police because of our involvement with the DC hub?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 2:54 am 
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tcj Wrote:
How about the Obner DC hub - are us users at risk (can they see this kind of activity?) Or is the RIAA just peeking in on the typical P2P applications like Soulseek, Kazaa, etc? Anyone know if we should start expecting visits from the Music Police because of our involvement with the DC hub?


Yes you are at risk unfortunately, and I’ll repost one of my earlier posts from this year. Interestingly enough Soulseek has never been named by the RIAA while all others have. I think it has to do with it being mostly an Indie, IDM and Underground Hip-Hop site while others seem to carry No Doubt ect. It won’t last because slsk is now too big and it’s only a matter of time before they are named by the RIAA.


Two convicted in landmark internet piracy trial

Wednesday January 19, 2005

Two men yesterday became the first individuals ever convicted for breaking copyright privacy by offering illegal movie files on the internet.

William Trowbridge, 50, from New York, and Michael Chicoine, 47, from Texas, yesterday pleaded guilty to the charge of committing criminal copyright infringement before a US court. The American justice department said both men made available millions of dollars worth of movies, music, computer games and software on peer-to-peer sites that they maintained for two years.

"As today's pleas demonstrate, those who steal copyrighted material will be caught, even when they use the tools of technology to commit their crimes," the US attorney general, John Ashcroft, said. "The theft of intellectual property victimises not only its owners and their employees but also the American people, who shoulder the burden of increased costs for goods and services."

According to the Hollywood Reporter, the men were arrested as a result of a joint FBI-justice department investigation, called Operation Digital Gridlock, launched last August. The operation targeted five peer-to-peer networks, which require users to share large quantities of computer files with other users, all of whom could download each other's shared files.

Trowbridge and Chicoine owned, maintained and operated websites which allowed files to be swapped using file-sharing software called Direct Connect. Government agents downloaded 35 copyrighted works worth nearly $5,000 from Chicoine's site and more than 70 copyrighted works worth $20,650 from Trowbridge's.

Both men risk a maximum of five years in prison and a $250,000 fine. They will be sentenced on April 29.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:25 am 
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tcj Wrote:
How about the Obner DC hub - are us users at risk (can they see this kind of activity?) Or is the RIAA just peeking in on the typical P2P applications like Soulseek, Kazaa, etc? Anyone know if we should start expecting visits from the Music Police because of our involvement with the DC hub?


not likely on the obner hub (the only one i use), but other hubs may be less secure


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