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 Post subject: john Sidney McCain always a scumball?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:35 pm 
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frostingspoon
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Has everyone read this Rolling Stone (paragon of journalism) article on what a dirtball John McCain has always been? 
http://www.rollingstone.com/news/covers ... ohn_mccain <http://www.rollingstone.com/news/coverstory/make_believe_maverick_the_real_john_mccain>
 
On the one hand, I think that being a unrepentant dirtball riding your daddy's coattails probably makes you a better president.  On the other hand, I'm a little tired of having dirtballs in the oval office.  On the third hand, the career navy officers that I've known over the years have gotten a lot of sweet sweet poon in spite of their wives protestations, and maybe that's the greatest qualification for the highest office in the land. 


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:38 pm 
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yeah we've been discussing this. he really is a dirtball.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:39 pm 
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ive only read the first half or so, but the parts i did read made him sound like a humongous douche. saying he road coattails is a huge understatement. he practically built a home on them.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:42 pm 
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Jann Wenner isn't much better.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:58 pm 
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F**k You, Dave Wrote:
Obama isn't much better.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:00 pm 
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TOO MANY WORDS

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:07 pm 
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I can't believe Rolling Stone would take the time to try to make a Republican look bad.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:12 pm 
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I'm not a mccain supporter, but this article reeks of bullshit.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:20 pm 
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because its impossible to believe that a rich kid was a lazy petulant bastard and got to the top through his connections?

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:23 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
TOO MANY WORDS


rolling stone should go to a method whereby they tell their stories with cell phone photos and two-three sentence descriptions

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:23 pm 
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they keep coming up with these perfect quotes from people to support their point, the most damning of which are from McCain himself.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:25 pm 
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Its not like this is the first place this stuff has appeared, there are several books on the "real" mccain including one by that very name and another, McCain: The Myth of a Maverick that billyg just read.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:53 pm 
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Quote:
During his 1992 campaign, at the end of a long day, McCain's wife, Cindy, mussed his receding hair and needled him playfully that he was "getting a little thin up there." McCain reportedly blew his top, cutting his wife down with the kind of language that had gotten him hauled into court as a high schooler: "At least I don't plaster on the makeup like a trollop, you cunt." Even though the incident was witnessed by three reporters, the McCain campaign denies it took place.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:54 pm 
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McCain's frequently inappropriate humor has also led many to question his self-control. In 1998, the senator told a joke about President Clinton's teenage daughter at a GOP fundraiser. "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly?" McCain asked. "Because her father is Janet Reno!"

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:55 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Quote:
McCain's frequently inappropriate humor has also led many to question his self-control. In 1998, the senator told a joke about President Clinton's teenage daughter at a GOP fundraiser. "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly?" McCain asked. "Because her father is Janet Reno!"


Mean, nasty, and inappropriate.
But still funny.
I am ashamed.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 5:15 pm 
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PopTodd Wrote:
Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Quote:
McCain's frequently inappropriate humor has also led many to question his self-control. In 1998, the senator told a joke about President Clinton's teenage daughter at a GOP fundraiser. "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly?" McCain asked. "Because her father is Janet Reno!"


Mean, nasty, and inappropriate.
But still funny.
I am ashamed.


Yeah, that's pretty good...

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 5:32 pm 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Quote:
McCain's frequently inappropriate humor has also led many to question his self-control. In 1998, the senator told a joke about President Clinton's teenage daughter at a GOP fundraiser. "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly?" McCain asked. "Because her father is Janet Reno!"

Damn. I remember when that one made headlines. I think it was the spark that started the 'Hands off Chelsea' policy.

John's a mean-spirited douchebag, but I'm not sure I'd call him a scumball. For me scumball implies corruption or lack of ethics. I think McCain is wrong on most issues, but I believe he thinks he's acting in the best interest of the country and I think that he's (or at least, was) generally an honest guy.

As I watch his campaign devolve into a sleazy ooze, there's a very good chance I'll consider him a scumball by election day though.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 5:36 pm 
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mugwump67 Wrote:
John's a mean-spirited douchebag, but I'm not sure I'd call him a scumball. For me scumball implies corruption or lack of ethics. I think McCain is wrong on most issues, but I believe he thinks he's acting in the best interest of the country and I think that he's (or at least, was) generally an honest guy.


The linked article aims to change your mind, on your terms.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:01 pm 
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i started reading this article last night. i'm not sure how much i believe of it though it's pretty entertaining.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:22 pm 
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Guys, we've all been dealt advantages and disadvantages by our parents.

And, I'm not saying this qualifies him to be president after the campaign he has run, but at what point does spending 5 years in a box after having your groin pierced, leg broken and shoulders broken, and after you have been offered an immediate ticket home because of WHO YOUR DAD IS, and refused it qualify as "riding daddy's coattails"?

The military, like it or not, and especially back then is pretty much the truest meritocracy in America.

I have come around to the fact that I can't vote for the dude because of Palin, but it doesn't mean he is a worthless piece of shit trading on his family's name ala W.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:19 am 
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grade A smear job, but i suspect its an attempt to give RS more exposure than to get McCain in the voter's doghouse.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:38 am 
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Sen. Clarence BeeksLooGAR Wrote:
The military, like it or not, and especially back then is pretty much the truest meritocracy in America.


In the period between Korea and Vietnam, military service offered an avenue of advancement for blacks found otherwise only in professional sports. But for the most part, this was limited to the enlisted ranks -- there were still relatively few black officers, even into the 1960's. Sociologists Charles C. Moskos and John Sibley Butler described this period as one of "organizational integration." The second, and equally important, phase, "leadership integration," would not occur until the mid-1970's.72. Charles C. Moskos and John Sibley Butler, All That We Can Be: Black Leadership and Racial Integration the Army Way

Would McCain have even gotten into the Naval Academy without family connections? He also finished 894 out of 899 midshipmen, and crashed five airplanes.. in this meritocracy.

No one (even a socialist pacifist like me) denies McCain's "service" to his country nor that he suffered as a prisoner of war.

His defending his negative attacks (in Wisconsin last week he looked directly at a reporter and angrily said that the TV ads saying Obama wanted to teach kindergarteners "about sex" were true and justified) needs to be criticized for what they are... cynical self-serving lies, far beyond usual campaign spin. And now he's making the opposition an angry black man... wait for Rev. Wright garbage being unearthed next week.

He suffered as a prisoner of war in patriotic service to his country: yep. He's lost all integrity in this campaign: yep. Both are true.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:18 am 
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Sen. Clarence BeeksLooGAR Wrote:
The military, like it or not, and especially back then is pretty much the truest meritocracy in America.


Like I said to Mug, the article squares off against this directly, citing examples of how he only got in and rose through the ranks because of repeating pulling of major, major strings, often times after doing things that are usually guaranteed to cause you to lose your wings, be demoted, or get kicked out entirely. Ie, the antithesis of a meritocracy.

Whether you believe the article or not is a different (and valid) question, but it sounds like you didn't read it?

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:27 am 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Sen. Clarence BeeksLooGAR Wrote:
The military, like it or not, and especially back then is pretty much the truest meritocracy in America.


Like I said to Mug, the article squares off against this directly, citing examples of how he only got in and rose through the ranks because of repeating pulling of major, major strings, often times after doing things that are usually guaranteed to cause you to lose your wings, be demoted, or get kicked out entirely. Ie, the antithesis of a meritocracy.

Whether you believe the article or not is a different (and valid) question, but it sounds like you didn't read it?


The one thing I though that article misportrayed was that I don't think McCain has ever denied that he didn't have family coatails to ride on early in his career. I remember watching a special on him in like 2001, where McCain very candidly talked about his family's legacy and how he did everything to screw it up in his youth. I feel like McCain has always been upfront with his callow youth, and that's why I think you see so many quotes from McCain in that piece. Then it overlays very dubious evidence that McCain hasn't changed since he was at the Naval Academy.

It's kind of like the Weekly Standard doing an article on Obama doing drugs in high school like it's a big secret.

But I agree with Harry and Dave that McCain sold himself to the devil in this election. I would still vote for the "Straight Talk Express" if it still existed in 08', which it doesn't. So give me my Barry button.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:30 am 
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Kingfish Wrote:
Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
Sen. Clarence BeeksLooGAR Wrote:
The military, like it or not, and especially back then is pretty much the truest meritocracy in America.


Like I said to Mug, the article squares off against this directly, citing examples of how he only got in and rose through the ranks because of repeating pulling of major, major strings, often times after doing things that are usually guaranteed to cause you to lose your wings, be demoted, or get kicked out entirely. Ie, the antithesis of a meritocracy.

Whether you believe the article or not is a different (and valid) question, but it sounds like you didn't read it?


The one thing I though that article misportrayed was that I don't think McCain has ever denied that he didn't have family coatails to ride on early in his career. I remember watching a special on him in like 2001, where McCain very candidly talked about his family's legacy and how he did everything to screw it up in his youth. I feel like McCain has always been upfront with his callow youth, and that's why I think you see so many quotes from McCain in that piece. Then it overlays very dubious evidence that McCain hasn't changed since he was at the Naval Academy.

It's kind of like the Weekly Standard doing an article on Obama doing drugs in high school like it's a big secret.

But I agree with Harry and Dave that McCain sold himself to the devil in this election. I would still vote for the "Straight Talk Express" if it still existed in 08', which it doesn't. So give me my Barry button.


I agree with almost all of this.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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