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 Post subject: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 10:58 am 
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This came about as a result of two Rolling Stone articles - one about Paul Simon, the other about Bob Dylan's 70 Greatest Songs.

Having already done Dylan, and neither of us being too sure about committing to a Simon thread, we came up with The Byrds.

I remember thinking like The Cros when I was about 15 or 16 - I like Dylan's songs, but man that guy can't sing. Only later did I realize that was part of the charm.

Anyway, they don't have a thousand albums, so this should go short and sweet. Play along if you like:

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allmusic Wrote:
One of the greatest debuts in the history of rock, Mr. Tambourine Man was nothing less than a significant step in the evolution of rock & roll itself, demonstrating that intelligent lyrical content could be wedded to compelling electric guitar riffs and a solid backbeat. It was also the album that was most responsible for establishing folk-rock as a popular phenomenon, its most alluring traits being Roger McGuinn's immediately distinctive 12-string Rickenbacker jangle and the band's beautiful harmonies. The material was uniformly strong, whether they were interpreting Bob Dylan (on the title cut and three other songs, including the hit single "All I Really Want to Do"), Pete Seeger ("The Bells of Rhymney"), or Jackie DeShannon ("Don't Doubt Yourself, Babe"). The originals were lyrically less challenging, but equally powerful musically, especially Gene Clark's "I Knew I'd Want You," "I'll Feel a Whole Lot Better," and "Here Without You"; "It's No Use" showed a tougher, harder-rocking side and a guitar solo with hints of psychedelia.



Mr. Tambourine Man
Code:
http://www.mediafire.com/?xpzmbo42v4y

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I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 11:10 am 
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Even if the sound that defined the band was Roger McGuinn's 12-string Rick, here -- early on -- this is Gene Clark's show, at least as far as the songwriting is concerned.
This is the album where Clark was really allowed to shine as a songwriter. In fact, whereas most folks think of McGuinn as the nominal leader of the band, it could be argued that, on this record, it was undeniably Clark who lead the way. He wrote the bulk of the original material, and certainly wrote the best of it. "I'll Feel a Whole Lot Better" is an undeniable classic, and "Here Without You" should have been, although it is perhaps a bit too dark to climb up on that mantle.
Later on, as McGuinn began to grow as a songwriter, he grabbed the reins from Clark straight-out, and all but forced him from the band. The Byrds evolved from there, but this is a helluva starting point.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 11:23 am 
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PopTodd Wrote:
"Here Without You" should have been, although it is perhaps a bit too dark to climb up on that mantle.


Exactly. "Ticket to Ride" already had that covered as most depressing pop song of the 60s.

(The Carpenters version is even more soporific.)


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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 7:55 pm 
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This was the first time I've actually heard this record. I've got quite a few Byrds albums but I think because of the title track I've just never really wanted to. Which is a shame because it's as good, or nearly as good as the blurb, suggests. It's hard to even comprehend what this sounded like to virgin ears in 1965. I've had a bit of a personal challenge this week and honestly I felt myself cottoning to some of this music, more so than I normally would. That being said, the 'Times They Are A Changin' is sounds horribly dated when the Byrds sing it. With Dylan, the prematurely old voice makes it sound prophetic and serious. With the Byrds, it sounds like some cheerful and happy young people who are singing in front of a Christian youth group. Blech.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 8:07 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 8:36 pm 
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DumpJack Wrote:
This was the first time I've actually heard this record. I've got quite a few Byrds albums but I think because of the title track I've just never really wanted to. Which is a shame because it's as good, or nearly as good as the blurb, suggests. It's hard to even comprehend what this sounded like to virgin ears in 1965. I've had a bit of a personal challenge this week and honestly I felt myself cottoning to some of this music, more so than I normally would. That being said, the 'Times They Are A Changin' is sounds horribly dated when the Byrds sing it. With Dylan, the prematurely old voice makes it sound prophetic and serious. With the Byrds, it sounds like some cheerful and happy young people who are singing in front of a Christian youth group. Blech.

I go back and forth with their version of Tambourine Man, but lurv the "Chimes of Freedom" on this. Played it thrice today.

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Throughout his life, from childhood until death, he was beset by severe swings of mood. His depressions frequently encouraged, and were exacerbated by, his various vices. His character mixed a superficial Enlightenment sensibility for reason and taste with a genuine and somewhat Romantic love of the sublime and a propensity for occasionally puerile whimsy.
harry Wrote:
I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

FT Wrote:
LooGAR (the straw that stirs the drink)


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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 8:37 pm 
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PopTodd Wrote:
Later on, as McGuinn began to grow as a songwriter, he grabbed the reins from Clark straight-out, and all but forced him from the band.



I've seen you say this several times and have never seen anyone else claim that. I even did a quick google search today looking for anyone claiming Clark was fired or unfairly pushed out of the band and couldn't find any other claims (granted I gave up quickly). I know McGuinn has a reputation for being prickly and the turnover in the band suggests that he was hard to work with. I've also read that there was tension caused by Clark making a lot more based on songwriting royalties but I've never heard he was unfairly pushed out. I've read two explanations of his departure: one being he quit to persue a solo career with encouragement from his managers (which McGuinn claims) and more commonly that he hated touring and was afraid of flying and either quit or was pressured to leave (quite understandably) as they needed to tour.

I like the Clark fronted lineup the most and like Clark's solo material as well. I'm curious where you get the idea that Clark was a victim here though because it's news to me if true.


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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 10:12 pm 
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billy g Wrote:
PopTodd Wrote:
Later on, as McGuinn began to grow as a songwriter, he grabbed the reins from Clark straight-out, and all but forced him from the band.



I've seen you say this several times and have never seen anyone else claim that. I even did a quick google search today looking for anyone claiming Clark was fired or unfairly pushed out of the band and couldn't find any other claims (granted I gave up quickly)....
I like the Clark fronted lineup the most and like Clark's solo material as well. I'm curious where you get the idea that Clark was a victim here though because it's news to me if true.

I have to admit that the version of the band's backstory that I am putting forth as "truth" here, is really only the version that I got from Rick Clark (Gene's brother) when I met him at a Gene Clark tribute show that I played a few years back.
So yeah, that's a bit biased. I got the feeling that he didn't like ol' Jim very much.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 7:48 am 
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Quote:
The Byrds' second album, Turn! Turn! Turn!, was only a disappointment in comparison with Mr. Tambourine Man. They couldn't maintain such a level of consistent magnificence, and the follow-up was not quite as powerful or impressive. It was still quite good, however, particularly the ringing number one title cut, a classic on par with the "Mr. Tambourine Man" single. Elsewhere, they concentrated more on original material, Gene Clark in particular offering some strong compositions with "Set You Free This Time," "The World Turns All Around Her," and "If You're Gone." A couple more Bob Dylan covers were included, as well, and "Satisfied Mind" was their first foray into country-rock, a direction they would explore in much greater depth throughout the rest of the '60s.

Code:
http://rapidshare.com/files/70159694/Byrds_-_Turn__Turn__Turn__part_1.zip
http://rapidshare.com/files/70157926/Byrds_Turn_Turn_Turn_part_2.zip

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 7:50 am 
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I realized that I actually listened to to Turn Turn Turn rather than Mr Tambourine Man yesterday, so read my earlier thoughts on today's album. I'll listen to both again today.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 10:04 am 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
Image


had no idea she was in UWP...

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 10:49 am 
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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 11:30 am 
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Tee Wrote:
Super Bowl X: Pitt def. Dallas (halftime show: Up with People)

How did you not know this, Bob?


oh, i totally remember all those up with people halftime shows from back in the '70s and early '80s

i just never knew alex the bunny boiler was once a member

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 1:46 pm 
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Turn, Turn, Turn is pretty fucking good. Nothing earth shattering or that different from what I expected, but part of this project's original thoughtline was "Why are The Byrds (outside of the oft name-checked Sweetheart) not a bigger fave of more Obs." They seem to do what a lot of people profess to love (handclaps, harmonies, Rickenbocker) better than the other purveyors of the same sound.

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Throughout his life, from childhood until death, he was beset by severe swings of mood. His depressions frequently encouraged, and were exacerbated by, his various vices. His character mixed a superficial Enlightenment sensibility for reason and taste with a genuine and somewhat Romantic love of the sublime and a propensity for occasionally puerile whimsy.
harry Wrote:
I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

FT Wrote:
LooGAR (the straw that stirs the drink)


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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 4:44 pm 
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It wouldn't exactly be original to parallel The Byrds with The Beatles but I think the first two albums by each band are similar.

While the debut albums were not as musically complex or original and didn't really represent or reflect the whole sixties zeitgeist thing as they did on later works, if judged simply as little capsules of rock n' roll, they might just be the best things either band ever did.

The follow ups disappoint slightly in the shadow of their predecessors but still had their merits even if there is some nagging desire to hear some kind of evolution that doesn't really happen on either LP. I suspect thought that may be from the perspective of looking back on history knowing what would happen later rather than experiencing it at the time.

Oh, and I forgot to say almost without exception I prefer the 'alternative takes' (especially 'She Has A Way') that were included on the expanded and re-issued albums.

And I also forgot to say if I want to become enraged for any particular reason, I just look at pictures of David Crosby from around this period. I have one on my hard drive of him and Slick Grace from about '68 that never fails to produce the berserker cry of "DIE! You filthy degenerate hippy scumbag!" in a out of character outburst of Conservatism.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 7:10 pm 
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Vic Da Baron LooGAR Wrote:
Turn, Turn, Turn is pretty fucking good. Nothing earth shattering or that different from what I expected, but part of this project's original thoughtline was "Why are The Byrds (outside of the oft name-checked Sweetheart) not a bigger fave of more Obs." They seem to do what a lot of people profess to love (handclaps, harmonies, Rickenbocker) better than the other purveyors of the same sound.


I actually preferred this to Mr. Tambourine Man actually. Still, a pretty spectacular debut though. When I was listening to this today, I again considered what it must have been like to hear something like this for the first time, in contrast to other non-Rubber Soul music in 1965.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2011 10:16 am 
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Although the Byrds' Fifth Dimension was wildly uneven, its high points were as innovative as any rock music being recorded in 1966. Immaculate folk-rock was still present in their superb arrangements of the traditional songs "Wild Mountain Thyme" and "John Riley." For the originals, they devised some of the first and best psychedelic rock, often drawing from the influence of Indian raga in the guitar arrangements. "Eight Miles High," with its astral lyrics, pumping bassline, and fractured guitar solo, was a Top 20 hit, and one of the greatest singles of the '60s. The minor hit title track and the country-rock-tinged "Mr. Spaceman" are among their best songs; "I See You" has great 12-string psychedelic guitar solos; and "I Come and Stand at Every Door" is an unusual and moving update of a traditional rock tune, with new lyrics pleading for peace in the nuclear age. At the same time, the R&B instrumental "Captain Soul" was a throwaway, "Hey Joe" not nearly as good as the versions by the Leaves or Jimi Hendrix, and "What's Happening?!?!" the earliest example of David Crosby's disagreeably vapid hippie ethos. These weak spots keep Fifth Dimension from attaining truly classic status. [The CD reissue has six notable bonus tracks, including the single version of the early psychedelic cut "Why" (the B-side to "Eight Miles High"), a significantly different alternate take of "Eight Miles High," "I Know My Rider" (with some fine Roger McGuinn 12-string workouts), and a much jazzier, faster instrumental version of "John Riley."]

Code:
http://rapidshare.com/files/70164177/Byrds_5D__320__Bonus_Tracks__part1.zip
http://rapidshare.com/files/70162723/Byrds_5D__320_part2.zip


I like wildly uneven.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2011 10:49 am 
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Little Steven has been playing that I Know My Rider a bunch lately - which I believe was the first inkling of doing a Byrds-a-Thon. Great tune.

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Throughout his life, from childhood until death, he was beset by severe swings of mood. His depressions frequently encouraged, and were exacerbated by, his various vices. His character mixed a superficial Enlightenment sensibility for reason and taste with a genuine and somewhat Romantic love of the sublime and a propensity for occasionally puerile whimsy.
harry Wrote:
I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

FT Wrote:
LooGAR (the straw that stirs the drink)


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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 3:30 pm 
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...

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Last edited by DumpJack on Mon May 23, 2011 6:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 6:47 pm 
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So uh, I know no one else is checking this, but you just posted the same album...

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Throughout his life, from childhood until death, he was beset by severe swings of mood. His depressions frequently encouraged, and were exacerbated by, his various vices. His character mixed a superficial Enlightenment sensibility for reason and taste with a genuine and somewhat Romantic love of the sublime and a propensity for occasionally puerile whimsy.
harry Wrote:
I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

FT Wrote:
LooGAR (the straw that stirs the drink)


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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 6:54 pm 
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Vic Da Baron LooGAR Wrote:
So uh, I know no one else is checking this, but you just posted the same album...


Copy and paste error, my bad. I prep the posts in a text file before I post up.

Image
Quote:
Younger Than Yesterday was somewhat overlooked at the time of its release during an intensely competitive era that found the Byrds on a commercial downslide. However, time has shown it to be the most durable of the Byrds' albums, with the exception of Mr. Tambourine Man. David Crosby, Roger McGuinn, and especially Chris Hillman come into their own as songwriters on an eclectic but focused set blending folk-rock, psychedelia, and early country-rock. The sardonic "So You Want to Be a Rock & Roll Star" was a terrific single; "My Back Pages," also a small hit, was the last of their classic Dylan covers; "Thoughts and Words," the flower-power anthem "Renaissance Fair," "Have You Seen Her Face," and the bluegrass-tinged "Time Between" are all among their best songs. The jazzy "Everybody's Been Burned" may be Crosby's best composition, although his "Mind Gardens" is one of his most excessive. [The CD reissue has six bonus tracks, including the fine Crosby-penned single "Lady Friend," and notably different alternate versions of "Mind Gardens" and "My Back Pages."]

Code:
http://www.mediafire.com/?g0slmydtm5j

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 5:08 am 
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For whatever reason 'Time Between' is one of my all time favorite songs.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 8:20 am 
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Evil Dr. K Wrote:
For whatever reason 'Time Between' is one of my all time favorite songs.

That's a great song. And Clarence White absolutely kills it on that one!

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 8:25 am 
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Getting through that first album is a chore. Something about these guys grates my nerves. On the plus side they remind me how much I like Dylan's voice. I'm wondering if I should continue or leave well enough alone.

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 Post subject: Re: New Loog and Dumpjack Listening Party of Fail (The Byrds)
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 2:25 pm 
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I haven't been following this thread, but it's reminding that the Byrds are one of the (many, many) artists where I've heard a ton of music, spread across many albums, that I generally like, but never checked out any of their albums. There's just too much music out there, people!

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