When are people going to realize that your average American not only doesn't care about the killing of innocent people, but are probably, at least subconsciously, deriving some kind of joy out of knowing that Iraqis are dead?

uh... what??

In your argument... "all those people" you are advising, somehow don't realize that they secretly enjoy the death of innocents? And how shall we convince all those people?

Of course My Lai wasn't any kind of tipping point either... it secretly built more support for that war.

Man. I KNEW this was gonna make it here eventually.

THis one is simple. If it's true, prosecute them and let them serve whatever punishment is appropriate.

If it's not true, bomb the hell out of the middle east agian.

(the second one is a joke, you buttheads).

Well, March of 1968 to 1975 is 7 years, and I think the Christmas Bombings were in December of 1972, so yeah, I guess My Lai was almost right in the middle...4 more years, jocko.

I was gonna keep my powder dry, but I would also like to send a message to the media, congress, and aging hippies: NO ONE CARES ABOUT VIET NAM, either!! The only thing I care about is that we didn't drop a 10 mega ton warhead on Hanoi...Iraq isn't Viet Nam...sure the people are brown and inferior, but the similarities end there.

GAR.

Call me overly cynical, but I pretty much assumed this type of stuff has been going on all over the place since we started on the ground. So I'm kind of perplexed by the furor and almost naive level of shock at this now that we have a smoking gun, of sorts.
Doesn't make it at all right and I agree there should be punishment for the stuff you can prove. But c'mon people, it's war. We're not over there selling Girl Scout cookies. Get your head out of the sand.

I think the thing with americans during these days is that we expect our military to go over and kick some ass without alot of overkill and casualties and to do it with a high standard of morality and honor. The average american has hardly any complaints about military actions like the one that occured in Kosovo or when we retaliate against a direct attack or threat like we did in Afghanistan. When the war isn't going well, like the public perceives this Iraqi conflict, then events like this only go to further the failures of the conflict. If this was 91 and Schwartzkopf was leading the troops with Powell and this happened, most people would have said they were asking for it, but with Rummy, Cheney and Bush this time around, the public ain't so kind.
If Bush wouldn't have stood on a boat and said the war is more people would be accepting, but with high gas prices, inflation, and a struggling economy, alot of people are no longer content to see this drag on and get more furious something like this occurs.

You guys remember that you invaded that country, right? And that it's not a war, it's an occupation?

Yeah, but Saddam shouldn't've been talking all that shit, Rads. We told him to shut his punk ass up, or we would bring the pain. He kept yappin and got got.

And, if we didn't need a staging ground to invade IRAN, we wouldn't really care about IRAQ.

*bangs head against desk*

yeah this thread is excruciating.

Whatever it takes to protect FREEDOM.

Seriously, Gar, I think you're brutally correct here. The average American probably doesn't care about this and will forget about it before it's even played out.

But events like this do erode support a few percentage points at a time for other folks. Shit adds up after a while.

Kiddo... it's aged hippie, not aging. I am way there.

I think seeing Bush's approval rating dive so precipitously is in fact because many people do care about this mis-step, this brutal neo-con jerk off fantasy of invading and kicking butt 'cause Sadam was talking smack.

Tipping point, jocko. What you hear is the rushing sound of your world passing... talk to me the middle of November.

I care about Vietnam.

Many people do care. They're just not exceptionally adept at getting elected.

Unfortunately, he's still president, they're still in control of both houses of the legislature, and I can damn near guarantee you another Supreme Court justice before the monkey boy leaves office.

So, like it or not, like Al Haig would say "I'm in Control!!"

and cotton, you and those 6 drunks at the VFW will have a GOOOOOOOOD time on Labor Day, but good luck getting anybody else to think about, much less vote on anything Viet Nam related.

Goddam Nader.

i'm not saying i'm in the commonplace at all. but what the average american cares about and what the average politician cares about are night and fucking day.

and are you counting on Stevens or Kennedy to pop off?

I'm not sure who, but it will involve amyl nitrate and 3 pictures.