Where did you apologize? It sounded to me like you rationalized your intolerance and then tut-tutted the intolerance of others, but maybe I mistook your tone?

Drag-race?



GET 'ER DONE!

yeah, you did.

still hard to read that as an apology. it's kind of one of those "i'm sorry you feel that way" apologies, i guess.

I'm still trying to figure out who the spade was.

The problem is not theology, theism in general, doctrinal differences, but rather the cultural inclination to fundamentalism. How many RC bishops, and what noise out of the Vatican, suggested that Catholics could not receive mass, and might be ex-communicated, if they voted for Kerry in 2004.

In a sense, crackpotism knows no religion... the evangelical christian protestants, the hard-line falangist opus dei roman catholics, the rabbi kahani zionists, the wahabist fundamental islamist word trade center pilots.... all have much more in common with each other than their differing creeds would indicate. Now, if they could only open their hearts to a living, transforming Spirit.

boy what a nutjob

Whom? Harry? He's one of the most reasoned Obnerians we have.

of course!

Just to clarify. I think it would be a fair descriptor to use the term fundamentalist of fanatic in front of the "evangelical christian protestant" sect that you mentioned. Ultimately this is my point. Evangelical, Protestant, Christian or any combination of the three does not immediately place that person into the category with the well-described others you mentioned. After all, I don't think that a evangelical protestant christian has all that much in common with a fundamentalist world trade center pilot muslim. But a fanatic ultra-conservative fundamentalist right wing christian may. evangelical and protestant should be separate from this discussion. I am starting to ramble, but I don't think that evangelical, protestant or christian implies radical fundamentalism.

Beautifully put, as usual, harry. Living up to that Spirit's desires for our lives is the hard part, especially in the cultural inclinations of our day. Sadly, I fail as often as I succeed. Y'know that was the real purpose of the laodicea username that I had for a while. That description of the Revelation church fits me far too often. Others might admit to the same, if inclined to the Christian faith.

Good points. But "unless you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your Savior you will burn for eternity in a lake of hellfire ..." which is the Good News that motivates the evangelism... this does beg a certain scrutiny. And, I think, this does lead naturally to a kind of fundamentalism that is very dangerous, poisonous.

As Stop Breathin' points out, ultimately it is the fruits of the Spirit that count. My father was a fundamentalist minister... and was as open and loving as the Dalai Lama. For all my enlightenment, Taoism, reasoned thought, New Age "working on myself" and leftist justice..... I will never approach his degree of authentic love and acceptance.

Yeah. I understand what you are saying. Again though, I think "unless you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your Savior you will burn for eternity in a lake of hellfire" is not the mantra that motivates ALL evangelicals. Nor is it what evangelism means. It is simply one way some select group has decided to evangelize. Although, I think it is useless in today's day, it was not without it's merits in it's time either. This hellfire and damnation type of preaching and evangelizing is one aspect and arguably one main impetus behind the period in american history deemed, "the great revival". However, there are many many types of philosophies on how to evangelize. Evangelism is an important part of christianity. However, it doesn't imply that you're standing on a street corner shouting "turn or burn" or waving horribly insensitive signs at the funeral of a soldier.

I do know what you mean about someone like your father. My grandfather was someone I look/looked to in that way. Different I am sure than your father in many ways. He was a devout catholic, a simple man in terms of knowledge and education (he was a dry cleaner employee his whole life with the exception of his WWII duties), yet was the human living closest to the example that Christ set in the Bible that I have ever met to this day. It was done effortlessly. It was a part of who he was. I try and force myself to be that way sometimes, but then I just come across as fake.

Thanks, very moving. This is is Grace... which is unmerited favor... to me it seems our job is to be willing to receive this gift, not to stand in front of men and women and appear holy... willingness it seems grows from gratitude.

And Grace comes in many languages, creeds, traditions, and chaos. One river, many wells. Grace is fractal.

Now look at this digital dialogue about these things that these crazy damaged God-hates-fags-dead-soldiers people have generated. I'm telling you, fractal.