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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:33 pm 
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Kiev Wrote:
... Is Nike having all the consumers who but these shoes arrested or fined? No - there coming out with even better product to keep consumers and retailers satisfied.


[nitpick] Haaang on... they don't have the prosecution options that record labels do, because downloading leaves a trail, and buying counterfeit sneakers with cash doesn't. It's not necessarily 100% genuine to say that shoe companies would NEVER do the same, since they can't anyway... they've never faced the decision that record co's have (ie, be an ass, not be an ass). [/nitpick]

Otherwise hell yeah... innovate, bastards.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:42 pm 
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Yeah but nobody feels bad about prosecuting sneaker counterfeiters... not true of prosecuting 13 year old kids who download music.

I donno bout music execs filling their ipods illicitly. I'd assume not, but then I might be surprised. We'll have to ask Katie and Dri.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:47 pm 
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Kiev Wrote:
Cap'n Scare-gle Wrote:
Kiev Wrote:
... Is Nike having all the consumers who but these shoes arrested or fined? No - there coming out with even better product to keep consumers and retailers satisfied.


[nitpick] Haaang on... they don't have the prosecution options that record labels do, because downloading leaves a trail, and buying counterfeit sneakers with cash doesn't. It's not necessarily 100% genuine to say that shoe companies would NEVER do the same, since they can't anyway... they've never faced the decision that record co's have (ie, be an ass, not be an ass). [/nitpick]

Otherwise hell yeah... innovate, bastards.


Not entirely true - the footwear industry is going hard after the counterfeiters - not after the consumers - lots of busts going on almost weekly in places like Chicago, DC, Baltimore - it's kind of a "whack a mole" approach though - funny thing is a lot of guys in the industry will wear knock offs (some are incredibly good) - do you think record company guys stock their Ipods with downloads - remixes and shit?


I don't think record labels are really going after the equivalent of knock off consumers...If you download an album off a blog for instance, what risk do you really think you have of being sued for it? I'd guess its pretty small. I believe that they are going after filesharers not downloaders. Filesharers are more the equivalent of counterfeiters in that they are making product available for download to the masses without any compensation to the true owners.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:55 pm 
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Kiev Wrote:
billy g Wrote:
Kiev Wrote:
Cap'n Scare-gle Wrote:
Kiev Wrote:
... Is Nike having all the consumers who but these shoes arrested or fined? No - there coming out with even better product to keep consumers and retailers satisfied.


[nitpick] Haaang on... they don't have the prosecution options that record labels do, because downloading leaves a trail, and buying counterfeit sneakers with cash doesn't. It's not necessarily 100% genuine to say that shoe companies would NEVER do the same, since they can't anyway... they've never faced the decision that record co's have (ie, be an ass, not be an ass). [/nitpick]

Otherwise hell yeah... innovate, bastards.


Not entirely true - the footwear industry is going hard after the counterfeiters - not after the consumers - lots of busts going on almost weekly in places like Chicago, DC, Baltimore - it's kind of a "whack a mole" approach though - funny thing is a lot of guys in the industry will wear knock offs (some are incredibly good) - do you think record company guys stock their Ipods with downloads - remixes and shit?


I don't think record labels are really going after the equivalent of knock off consumers...If you download an album off a blog for instance, what risk do you really think you have of being sued for it? I'd guess its pretty small. I believe that they are going after filesharers not downloaders. Filesharers are more the equivalent of counterfeiters in that they are making product available for download to the masses without any compensation to the true owners.


No one really knows who there after - I don't believe they've made an official statement saying "downloading is cool - just don't share" - very little information on the lawsuits has gone public - we just don't know who they're targeting


Did the footwear industry make an official statement saying "buying counterfeit goods is cool, just don't go into production of counterfeit goods"?

I'm not saying any label would endorse downloading...of course they wouldn't...but I think what makes it a threat to their industry that is entirely different than counterfeiters is that the product is digital and can be easily copied and circulated...they can't go after just a few illicit manufacturers...its the "consumers" themselves that are illegally distributing the product.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 7:09 pm 
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Spade Kitty Wrote:
alongwaltz Wrote:
Spade Kitty Wrote:
alongwaltz Wrote:

I'd have to assume that the people who don't buy any music at all are the MTV-watching, frat boy no-taste crowd who would have predominately shopped at places like Best Buy in the first place. I can't see how free downloading is responsible for independent record stores closing down.


Why would you assume this? We ran a poll on hipinion a while ago and something like 80% of the hipsters on there bought no music whatsoever.


I can't imagine calling yourself a music fan and not purchasing any cd's or dvd's.


You're a college kid with little to no income. Would you spend the little money you made working your shitty part time job on cds, if you could just get a burn or download of it? Of course not.


But I am and I do.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 7:17 pm 
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Jim Beam Wrote:
in toronto, there are no mom and pop stores. most places there are only the big chain stores. so why should i care if i cut into their profits. . . . .like t makes a difference.


I'd still rather go to Soundscapes or Rotate This than the HMV's and Sam The Recordman's, though.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 7:35 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:47 pm 
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i can't wait to buy this new Shins album in January!


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:49 pm 
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I don't have any either but if I really like something, I'll buy the album, see the band live, etc.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:22 pm 
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i dont buy many CDs at all, though i still buy some

I simply cant afford to after college fees, petrol, food etc.

So i download when i want to hear most new music

I wouldnt be buying those CDs if i couldnt download them, as i simply couldnt afford to, so the record company makes no real loss on me.

I really dont have any moral qualms about it


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:40 pm 
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greezy Wrote:
i think some sort of new music format is in order. right now we have the technology for way better audio quality than cds are capable of (and we're already realizing that with some of the albums remastered for surround sound on dvd). better quality will result in much more data, meaning much bigger files if you rip them to your computer. of course, really big files get shared on the internet, but its a hell of a lot more inconvenient to download a file thats 4 gigs than 3 megs.
i think then the file sharing would be more like movies than music. i know a lot more people who download crappy xvid copies of movies and still end up buying the dvd than people who download mp3s and still buy the cd. give the people something extra and they'll pay for it.


its already happened. dvd-audio and sacd. theyve both failed, because nobody cares about audio quality that good other than audiophiles, not to mention the need to buy a new player for the formats. and the trend seems to be actually going downwards, as evidenced by all the crappily encoded audio files available on p2p networks.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:39 am 
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Northern Soul Wrote:
greezy Wrote:
i think some sort of new music format is in order. right now we have the technology for way better audio quality than cds are capable of (and we're already realizing that with some of the albums remastered for surround sound on dvd). better quality will result in much more data, meaning much bigger files if you rip them to your computer. of course, really big files get shared on the internet, but its a hell of a lot more inconvenient to download a file thats 4 gigs than 3 megs.
i think then the file sharing would be more like movies than music. i know a lot more people who download crappy xvid copies of movies and still end up buying the dvd than people who download mp3s and still buy the cd. give the people something extra and they'll pay for it.


its already happened. dvd-audio and sacd. theyve both failed, because nobody cares about audio quality that good other than audiophiles, not to mention the need to buy a new player for the formats. and the trend seems to be actually going downwards, as evidenced by all the crappily encoded audio files available on p2p networks.

I also think the portability aspect of it was a big part of it's failure - no ability to be played in a standard CD player, no ability to simply be dumped into Itunes/etc and into an Ipod/etc. means that very, very few are interested. How many people are really all that interested in hearing the guitar in the front right channel and the bass in the left rear? Most people just want to hear their music in the easiest way possible and plain ol' stereo suits their needs just fine.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:52 am 
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To me, when you pay for a cd or record you're paying for the whole package- the cover art, the liner notes, the case, and the notion that you actually own the cd. Downloading is just a rip of a cd, that's why it is free.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:59 am 
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Mick the Stripper Wrote:
To me, when you pay for a cd or record you're paying for the whole package- the cover art, the liner notes, the case, and the notion that you actually own the cd. Downloading is just a rip of a cd, that's why it is free.


Should audiobooks be free, too?

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:05 am 
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The Slayer of Pimpletown Wrote:
Northern Soul Wrote:
greezy Wrote:
i think some sort of new music format is in order. right now we have the technology for way better audio quality than cds are capable of (and we're already realizing that with some of the albums remastered for surround sound on dvd). better quality will result in much more data, meaning much bigger files if you rip them to your computer. of course, really big files get shared on the internet, but its a hell of a lot more inconvenient to download a file thats 4 gigs than 3 megs.
i think then the file sharing would be more like movies than music. i know a lot more people who download crappy xvid copies of movies and still end up buying the dvd than people who download mp3s and still buy the cd. give the people something extra and they'll pay for it.


its already happened. dvd-audio and sacd. theyve both failed, because nobody cares about audio quality that good other than audiophiles, not to mention the need to buy a new player for the formats. and the trend seems to be actually going downwards, as evidenced by all th crappily encoded audio files available on p2p networks.

I also think the portability aspect of it was a big part of it's failure - no ability to be played in a standard CD player, no ability to simply be dumped into Itunes/etc and into an Ipod/etc. means that very, very few are interested. How many people are really all that interested in hearing the guitar in the front right channel and the bass in the left rear? Most people just want to hear their music in the easiest way possible and plain ol' stereo suits their needs just fine.


sure, surround sound isn't the greatest selling point. i'm talking a major leap forward in format that record companies and equipment manufacturers get behind. people started buying cds because they saw advantages in sound quality, durability and portability. i think it's totally possible that a new format that could sell on all those points (i.e. not skipping if it gets scratched).

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:23 am 
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Yeah, I actually liked minidiscs.

Right, Darrin?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:21 am 
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Record companies should provide some added incentive for non collectors to actually purchase the hard copy as opposed to just getting it from slsk or whatever. It's not like the manufacturing process actually costs much anyway.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:43 am 
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greezy Wrote:

sure, surround sound isn't the greatest selling point. i'm talking a major leap forward in format that record companies and equipment manufacturers get behind. people started buying cds because they saw advantages in sound quality, durability and portability. i think it's totally possible that a new format that could sell on all those points (i.e. not skipping if it gets scratched).


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