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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:07 pm 
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I'm probably spoiled. I went to my first hockey game this year and we just happen to have one of the best teams in the NHL in the Predators. I dig it as a casual spectator, but you'll never find me purposely watching a game on TV unless it's at a bar with friends.
Live hockey is pretty damn cool to watch and I agree that it takes a ton of skill to do what they do.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:09 pm 
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ok well i never saud the thing about playing as a kid, but i guess i partially agree with it. i played baseball through college and it's by far my favorite sport to watch partly because i can relate to the experience of playing.

with hockey, you can't even play in the back yard or have some small component of the paly be a bonding experience with your dad or something. you know, you can have a catch with a baseball or football or shoot some hoops very easily. unless you have a huge paved area or a frozen pond, you aren't playing much hockey at home, and there's no fun as far as i can see in passing a puck back and forth. so no emotional connection + no personal experience + toothless russians = who cares?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:09 pm 
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Hegel Wrote:
NHL 2K7 is one of the best sports games I have played.


Maybe but they've failed to generate the excitement that Madden and other games have when they're released. My younger cousins don't play it and I loved blades of steel and the other one that let you design your own players.

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I tried to find somebody of that sort that I could like that nobody else did - because everybody would adopt his group, and his group would be _it_; someone weird like Captain Beefheart. It's no different now - people trying to outdo ! each other in extremes. There are people who like X, and there are people who say X are wimps; they like Black Flag.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:10 pm 
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Kingfish Wrote:
BLADES OF STEEL out there right now.



HAHA!! Awesome.

I played my fingers to the bone playing that game.

HIT THE BODY! HIT THE BODY!!


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:11 pm 
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Kingfish Wrote:
Hockey has several problems. If you don't live in a big city, you have no way of playing it and most likely can't see it live. The league in general has been poorly managed and it's dropped off the radar alot. It's failed to market it stars like it once did. There's more competition for viewership these days. And the season is too long.

hmm... i don't know about the urban factor. by the time i was in college, there were three minor league hockey teams within 60 miles of my parents' home in rural pennsylvania. you may not see the NHL, but hockey's around in the north. of course, i also realize that's the exception.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:13 pm 
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Kingfish Wrote:
Hegel Wrote:
NHL 2K7 is one of the best sports games I have played.


Maybe but they've failed to generate the excitement that Madden and other games have when they're released. My younger cousins don't play it and I loved blades of steel and the other one that let you design your own players.


nhl 07 is also very good. and madden has been rotten for 2 years straight.

i have to say, another problem with hockey (that football shares, but has somehow transcended) is that the atheletes are all covered up with gear and the television angle on the game is far away. that makes it very hard to see emotion in the players and to take an interest in them personally. look at the star power in the nba. that league has sucked for years, the qality of play steadily declining, and it's still more popular because it's so easy to get to know the players. if hockey couldn't turn gretzky and mario into more ubiquitous stars, then there's no one who will be the jordan of the nhl.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:13 pm 
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If this cartoon came out today, the Gretsky character would be either Tiger Woods or Dale Jr but defintely not a hockey player.

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I tried to find somebody of that sort that I could like that nobody else did - because everybody would adopt his group, and his group would be _it_; someone weird like Captain Beefheart. It's no different now - people trying to outdo ! each other in extremes. There are people who like X, and there are people who say X are wimps; they like Black Flag.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:14 pm 
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thrillhouse Wrote:
ok well i never saud the thing about playing as a kid, but i guess i partially agree with it. i played baseball through college and it's by far my favorite sport to watch partly because i can relate to the experience of playing.

with hockey, you can't even play in the back yard or have some small component of the paly be a bonding experience with your dad or something. you know, you can have a catch with a baseball or football or shoot some hoops very easily. unless you have a huge paved area or a frozen pond, you aren't playing much hockey at home, and there's no fun as far as i can see in passing a puck back and forth. so no emotional connection + no personal experience + toothless russians = who cares?


I guess it's just experience because mine is completely different than that. I live about 30 minutes form the Ocean and there are about 3 ice rinks in the area that have hockey teams that kids play on all the way up to age 18. One of my sisters friends has an 11 year old kid who is unbelievable and will probably play in college. I think the lack of ability to play is more an issue because most likely your folks didn't care about hockey either so there were no steps taken to get you to play. However, the possibility definitely exists.

Just like you could play a pick up game of football with no pads, two hand touch, etc. you can play street hockey which doesn't really require much equipment at all. It just removes the ice skating or whatever. The possibilities exist. I imagine you got into baseball because your dad really loved it, played it, or watched it on tv all the time. It's sort of the same reason I did--my older brother played and all that too.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:16 pm 
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Z Wrote:
Kingfish Wrote:
Hockey has several problems. If you don't live in a big city, you have no way of playing it and most likely can't see it live. The league in general has been poorly managed and it's dropped off the radar alot. It's failed to market it stars like it once did. There's more competition for viewership these days. And the season is too long.

hmm... i don't know about the urban factor. by the time i was in college, there were three minor league hockey teams within 60 miles of my parents' home in rural pennsylvania. you may not see the NHL, but hockey's around in the north. of course, i also realize that's the exception.


You're probably right. I mean in context of the South & West, where it's hot as balls. I've never seen an ice skate.

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I tried to find somebody of that sort that I could like that nobody else did - because everybody would adopt his group, and his group would be _it_; someone weird like Captain Beefheart. It's no different now - people trying to outdo ! each other in extremes. There are people who like X, and there are people who say X are wimps; they like Black Flag.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:20 pm 
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BTW, I pretty much became a hockey fan playing EA Sports NHL '92, '93, and '94.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:23 pm 
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Yeah, but take the skating out of hockey and it's a completely different game. You can be as good with your stick as you want, but unless you are an excellent skater, you will completely suck at hockey.

And, in most places, parents not caring about hockey isn't so much the issue...parents not being able to afford to fork over hundreds of dollars for ice time is. If those three ice rinks near your home were free and available for pick up hockey whenever kids wanted to play, your town is most assuredly in the minority.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:33 pm 
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As a sport, I find it roughly 10,000 times more entertaining than football, baseball, basketball etc. As for why it's not popular in the US? I have no idea. Probably most of the variables people have already mentioned contribute to a degree. I suspect its mainly a cultural phenomenon.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:51 pm 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
BTW, I pretty much became a hockey fan playing EA Sports NHL '92, '93, and '94.


94 is the best game ever made


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:55 pm 
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I agree with a lot that's been said: doesn't translate to TV, didn't grow up playing it, etc... But I also think the media plays a huge role. American sports media just does not understand hockey the way they do other sports & nor do they care to.

None of the big "all sports guru's" who either work for or constantly appear on ESPN seem to be very hockey knowledgable. PTI, Around the Horn... stuff like that either ignores hockey or gives it a mediocre effort.

Eklund wrote a blog when the Phantoms won the AHL Calder Cup a couple years back during the NHL lockout & how people kept calling in this Philly sports radio show wanting to talk about it & the host wouldn't take the calls. He only wanted to talk Eagles football so he cut the hockey callers off.

Here in LA the countries second largest market & home to 2 teams who for a lot of the years since 1993 have out drawn the Lakers & Clippers it sucks. The cities biggest paper has 1 decent hockey writer & they reassigned her to be a columinst. So her weekly Tuesday hockey column is gone & barely any of her stories are about hockey. The two teams beat writers are absolute jokes. Kings beat writer doesn't travel anymore. And I think we end up with more from the AP story. The Kings have 1 decent beat writer who writes for an a variety of local papers owned by the same co. & I'm not sure if they spring for travel. One person on all the sports radio here has some hockey knowledge but he's teamed with guys who only dream is to wake up one morning with Kobe's dick on thier breath.

I'm sure it's the flip up in Canada. If you like the NFL, MLB or NBA you have to search out knowledgable homegrown sources[/url]

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:56 pm 
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thrillhouse Wrote:
Yail Bloor Wrote:
BTW, I pretty much became a hockey fan playing EA Sports NHL '92, '93, and '94.


94 is the best game ever made

fuck yes. many hours wasted (literally) on this game in college.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:58 pm 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
Also...

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will kick your ass


You gotta love the South East Division & their style:

1. Build a blueline that can't buy a headline (Havelid, Sarich, Hedican... who are these guys?)

2. Bulk up on forwards

3. Win the Cup

4. Spend the next few seasons hanging out between 7th & 9th place

And Thrillhouse '96 is the best ever. '94 was so much better than 95 after about a month of 95 I flipped back, but 96 is the best. I even looked on E-Bay Monday & came pretty close to buying a system & NHL '96.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:59 pm 
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In the modern era, an athlete needs to be smart to be able to play pro hockey. SMARGTG NOK GOOG.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:07 pm 
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Damen Wrote:
None of the big "all sports guru's" who either work for or constantly appear on ESPN seem to be very hockey knowledgable. PTI, Around the Horn... stuff like that either ignores hockey or gives it a mediocre effort.

i haven't watched ATH in years, but tim cowlishaw used to be a regular and covered the stars for years and always brought up hockey when he had an opportunity. also, PTI gets roenick or hull for five good minutes during the season and maybe barry melrose for the playoffs. they surely don't cover hockey nearly as much as the other big sports, but they give it air. again, these shows are about pulling ratings and hockey doesn't pull ratings, so discussing it a lot isn't much of a draw. if i want hockey coverage, i'll watch barry melrose and john buccigross on espnews.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:37 pm 
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discostu Wrote:
I'm probably spoiled. I went to my first hockey game this year and we just happen to have one of the best teams in the NHL in the Predators. I dig it as a casual spectator, but you'll never find me purposely watching a game on TV unless it's at a bar with friends.
Live hockey is pretty damn cool to watch and I agree that it takes a ton of skill to do what they do.


Does the PA guy still call for "FAAAAAAAANG FINGGGGGGGGGGGGGERS!" at every opportunity? haha

Good to see the Preds dominating this year.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:42 pm 
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Damen Wrote:

None of the big "all sports guru's" who either work for or constantly appear on ESPN seem to be very hockey knowledgable. PTI, Around the Horn... stuff like that either ignores hockey or gives it a mediocre effort.


ESPN covered hockey much more thoroughly when they actually carried the games; notice how ESPN has downplayed Arena Football and NASCAR for the last several years until now that they carry them they are everywhere. That's just business.

I mean the NHL ALL Star Game didnt outdraw Law & Order reruns on cable.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:43 pm 
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Yail Bloor Wrote:
south pacific Wrote:
Yail Bloor Wrote:
I enjoy hockey but freely admit that it will never be more than a niche sport.



Yeah. I think this is partially due to the violence.

I saw a couple Blackhawk games back in the day and they are more exciting to watch in a stadium than on TV.


I'd say violence ranks fourth in why its not popular (and maybe first or second in why it IS popular):

1. Translates bad to TV (as PT mantioned)
2. Foreigners (unpronounceable names, etc.)
3. Most people didnt play it growing up (unlike baseball, hoops, and even soccer)
4. Violence


Also, I'm surprised nobody's mentioned the lack of black players and fans. That can't help the popularity factor here in the U.S.

Can we get affirmative action to issue a mandate forcing NHL teams to play more African-Americans? :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:56 pm 
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south pacific Wrote:
Yail Bloor Wrote:
south pacific Wrote:
Yail Bloor Wrote:
I enjoy hockey but freely admit that it will never be more than a niche sport.



Yeah. I think this is partially due to the violence.

I saw a couple Blackhawk games back in the day and they are more exciting to watch in a stadium than on TV.


I'd say violence ranks fourth in why its not popular (and maybe first or second in why it IS popular):

1. Translates bad to TV (as PT mantioned)
2. Foreigners (unpronounceable names, etc.)
3. Most people didnt play it growing up (unlike baseball, hoops, and even soccer)
4. Violence


Also, I'm surprised nobody's mentioned the lack of black players and fans. That can't help the popularity factor here in the U.S.

Can we get affirmative action to issue a mandate forcing NHL teams to play more African-Americans? :lol:


GREATEST GOALIE EVER?
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He certainly has more rings than any other.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 2:40 pm 
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An example of sports writers just not caring:

A few months back ESPN magazine wrote an article on how damn tough the Southeast division is, how much talent they have, and the unfortunate aspect of less people excited about the sport. They had little pictures of star players and little blurbs about why they were so special, etc. There was a picture of Brind'Amour and it said, "Rod Brind'Amour was a key factor in bringing Atlanta the cup last year". Uh, ok ESPN.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 3:08 pm 
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I love hockey. The year, for the first time, I decided to get the NHL Center Ice package - mainly so I could watch the Sabres. But often I'll watch other games, too.

One thing that I don't think that has been mentioned is that, with the exception of Dallas (and even that only goes back to 1990) hockey is still relatively new to the south. And, for most of the time those teams have existed, most of them haven't been good- until recently. Success does wonders for a fan base, and I think we're seeing that in Tampa and Raleigh. But the teams need to stay competitive for a while, too -people new to a sport probably aren't going to have the kind of loyalty it takes to cheer on a loser.

But I agree, the bigger issues are probably poor translation to TV (although, I don't see how anyone could argue that playoff hockey is boring to watch on TV), and the fact that the climate in the south is essentially too warm for hockey. Look at all the places in the US where hockey is popular - Michigan, New England, New York, PA, Minnesota- all cold weather places.

Plus the season is way too long. There are far too many games where they players really aren't going all out.

Though I have to say, what Damen says about LA is weird - all the success they've had over the years, 2 teams, and so little coverage. LA is just kinda weird overall, though.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 3:41 pm 
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PopTodd Wrote:

GREATEST GOALIE EVER?
Image

He certainly has more rings than any other.


Ken Dryden might disagree with you.



Image

Ken Dryden might disagree with you.

Quote:
.....his NHL debut in mid-season 1971 for the Canadiens, and became the backbone of six Stanley Cup winning teams in the 1970s. During that first playoff season Dryden won the Conn Smythe Trophy, 1971, as the playoffs' most valuable player. The following year Dryden won the Calder Trophy, 1972, as the Rookie of the year because the previous year he did not play enough regular season games to be eligible...Compared to most other goaltending greats, Dryden's NHL career was extremely short: only seven full seasons. Therefore, statistically he did not amass record totals in most categories. As he played all his years with a dynasty and retired before he could pass his prime, his statistical percentages are unparalleled. His regular season totals include a .790 winning percentage, a 2.24 goals against average, and, most incredibly, losing only 57 games while recording 46 shutouts in 397 total games. No other modern goaltender has ever been even remotely close to earning nearly as many shutouts as recording losing games. He won the Vezina Trophy five times for allowing the fewest goals and in the same years was selected as a First Team All-Star. Despite the comparative brevity of his career, in 1998, he was ranked number 25 on The Hockey News' list of the 100 Greatest Hockey Players.

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