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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:57 am 
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Mick the Stripper Wrote:
Flying Rabbit Wrote:
Radcliffe Wrote:
boner pills Wrote:
i'm more interested if are there christians on this board.

Seriously? Stop Breathin, Hegel, The Theory and a couple others are pretty serious about their god-bothering.


Count me among the Jesus-followers as well.

Todd--it doesn't offend me in the least. I mean, I already think the "church" needs to loosen up and be less formal as it is. To me, the song isn't incorrect in saying that Jesus could score more goals than Gretzky, cause he could. Perhaps your friends are against the drug references with their Lord? I dunno, I think God has a sense of humor about him.


No way. The church needs to tighten up. There is nothing lamer than those young, "cool" churches and their douchebag "super-approachable" pastors. They are butchering faith into a marketable product.


I respectfully disagree. I think one of the problems with the church is the church. I stopped going to church in high school. Got completely turned off by the repetition, and how it didn't make sense in my life. I was raised Presbyterian btw. When you place yourself on a pedestal you're going to be mocked when you fall. If you never put yourself out that way, then people judge you much less for a Christian tag, and more of a person. That's just my experience. I'm honest with people, I'm fallible. I make mistakes. I put that out there. However, I don't see a lot of Christians being that open and being that readily prepared to admit that fact. Just calling them as I see them.

On the idea of a "super approachable" pastor--why wouldn't you want your pastor to be approachable? That makes no sense. No offense if anyone here is highly orthodox in their beliefs, but I want to be able to have a beer with my pastor and talk about life and Jesus. That's how it is with me, obviously you're different and want a sense of more reverence.

These "cool" churches are hitting the youth and young adults (not to mention middle-aged as well). To me, that's a positive. One thing that always irks me is that religion doesn't have to be stymied in tradition. I bet people were/are saying the same thing about Vatican II. "Those kids with their non-Latin services!" In my eyes, you have to stay current. If you want to have a relevant message, you have to be relevant with the times, and that means presenting the Gospels in a way people can relate to.



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faith into a marketable product.


...and that's a whole 'nother conversation.

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I just hate the way these types of churches generally pray on the weak, homeless, drug-addled and all-round less-fortunate, scrub them up and spit them out as half-brained god-dependent delusionals.


Wasn't that Jesus' thing?

I mean he said specifically to heal the sick.

Once again, I'm going to disagree on the basis that usually churches provide a certain community-based orientation which means that someone who happens to be down on his or her luck might find a support system to help them get on their feet.

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Baltimore is a town where everyone thinks they’re normal, but they’re totally insane. In New York, they think they’re crazy, but they’re perfectly normal. --John Waters
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Last edited by Flying Rabbit on Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:14 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:01 am 
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Mick the Stripper Wrote:
No way. The church needs to tighten up. There is nothing lamer than those young, "cool" churches and their douchebag "super-approachable" pastors. They are butchering faith into a marketable product.

I just hate the way these types of churches generally pray on the weak, homeless, drug-addled and all-round less-fortunate, scrub them up and spit them out as half-brained god-dependent delusionals.


I used to call them SUV churches. And that would be prey, no? But what a nice typo.

I am a faithful Episcopalian because its service is historical, worshipful, but also open to experiments. In our church truth is determined by three legs on the stool... scripture, tradtition, and reason. You bring your god-given reason into the church with you.

I am also a Taoist with no thought at all that being a Christian Taoist isn't ... um, reasonable.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:17 am 
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I think being all openly anti-religion is as annoying as just about anything these days, but at the same time, when I think of adults actually believing in the Christian God and believing the stories in the Bible...well, I'll just say it's moments like these that don't make me think too highly of humanity.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:24 am 
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Danny Don't Rapp Wrote:
I think being all openly anti-religion is as annoying as just about anything these days, but at the same time, when I think of adults actually believing in the Christian God and believing the stories in the Bible...well, I'll just say it's moments like these that don't make me think too highly of humanity.


I'm sorry.

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Baltimore is a town where everyone thinks they’re normal, but they’re totally insane. In New York, they think they’re crazy, but they’re perfectly normal. --John Waters
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:03 am 
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Danny Don't Rapp Wrote:
I think being all openly anti-religion is as annoying as just about anything these days, but at the same time, when I think of adults actually believing in the Christian God and believing the stories in the Bible...well, I'll just say it's moments like these that don't make me think too highly of humanity.



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"Because I believe in science."

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I'd probably just drink myself to death. More so, I mean.


"Hey Judas. I know you've made a grave mistake.
Hey Peter. You've been pretty sweet since Easter break."


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:08 am 
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damn that's a sweet terrycloth shirt.

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[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:35 am 
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I agree with Mick.

Also, There are no atheists in foxholes.

Carry on.

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Throughout his life, from childhood until death, he was beset by severe swings of mood. His depressions frequently encouraged, and were exacerbated by, his various vices. His character mixed a superficial Enlightenment sensibility for reason and taste with a genuine and somewhat Romantic love of the sublime and a propensity for occasionally puerile whimsy.
harry Wrote:
I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

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LooGAR (the straw that stirs the drink)


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:45 am 
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Danny Don't Rapp Wrote:
I think being all openly anti-religion is as annoying as just about anything these days, but at the same time, when I think of adults actually believing in the Christian God and believing the stories in the Bible...well, I'll just say it's moments like these that don't make me think too highly of humanity.


It's obviously difficult for an educated adult to believe in things like Adam and Eve, Noah and the Ark (esp. the pairs of animals thing), and a lot of other Old Testament stuff, but I know several who do, including my parents. I suppose the justification, and the reasoning I most sympathize with, is that all of that helps to paint a larger picture of the condition of humanity that is perhaps the richest and most accurate out there. That's certainly what Christians believe. A lot of them (Catholics, Evangelicals, some others) seem to think that the Bible is an all-or-nothing proposition in terms of allegory vs. literal fact (all the latter, only "parables" are the former), but I don't really see why that should be the case.

And I think the only Christians who would find that song offensive are the "Culture Warrior", moral crusader types who think it's their responsibility to build a "safe" Christian society where all Christian imagery is held in reverence by everyone, including and especially those who don't believe in or understand it in the first place. These are the kinds of people who look for things to find offensive, I think.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:08 pm 
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Sen. Posh Oltorf LooGAR Wrote:
Also, There are no atheists in foxholes.


That's proof of the existence of fear, not god.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:09 pm 
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Radcliffe Wrote:
Sen. Posh Oltorf LooGAR Wrote:
Also, There are no atheists in foxholes.


That's proof of the existence of fear, not god.


Oh I didn't say it as that, only that most atheists hold this notion until confronted with mortality.

_________________
Throughout his life, from childhood until death, he was beset by severe swings of mood. His depressions frequently encouraged, and were exacerbated by, his various vices. His character mixed a superficial Enlightenment sensibility for reason and taste with a genuine and somewhat Romantic love of the sublime and a propensity for occasionally puerile whimsy.
harry Wrote:
I understand that you, of all people, know this crisis and, in your own way, are working to address it. You, the madras-pantsed julip-sipping Southern cracker and me, the oldman hippie California fruit cake are brothers in the struggle to save our country.

FT Wrote:
LooGAR (the straw that stirs the drink)


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:18 pm 
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Believe in Adam and Eve? Does one "believe" in Mahler's 3rd (or the early Velvet Underground)?

These discussions about god and believe degenerate quickly in facile positioning and superficial conclusions.

As an aside, the first few chapters of Genesis have an astonishing foreshadowing of later science...big bang and evolution are pretty will covered there. But science is prose, and prose evolves, develops, dates, and gets antiquated. Poetry and song kinda adapt to the eternal.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:24 pm 
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I believe in Adam and Eve, the concept. Not the reality. I believe there is a need for archetypes and for illustrative composite.

Unfortunately the horrors done in the name of religion over the past 10,000 years or so still outweigh the peace and love. The nicety of form and ceremony is a pretty hat on a really ugly beast.

I lived in the beast for 18 years. Took another 20 to shake it.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:43 pm 
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harry Wrote:
Believe in Adam and Eve? Does one "believe" in Mahler's 3rd (or the early Velvet Underground)?

These discussions about god and believe degenerate quickly in facile positioning and superficial conclusions.

As an aside, the first few chapters of Genesis have an astonishing foreshadowing of later science...big bang and evolution are pretty will covered there. But science is prose, and prose evolves, develops, dates, and gets antiquated. Poetry and song kinda adapt to the eternal.


I think this a great way of putting it, but obviously a lot so-called "fundamentalist" Christians would disagree.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:07 pm 
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Drano Wrote:
harry Wrote:
Believe in Adam and Eve? Does one "believe" in Mahler's 3rd (or the early Velvet Underground)?

These discussions about god and believe degenerate quickly in facile positioning and superficial conclusions.

As an aside, the first few chapters of Genesis have an astonishing foreshadowing of later science...big bang and evolution are pretty will covered there. But science is prose, and prose evolves, develops, dates, and gets antiquated. Poetry and song kinda adapt to the eternal.


I think this a great way of putting it, but obviously a lot so-called "fundamentalist" Christians would disagree.


But harry, just as many would argue that Christianity and the Bible are antiquated, no matter how poetic, allegorical, or song (of Solomon) they are. Those who don't believe will always find something, usually including holding themselves superior, to dismiss Christianity. See Drano with the "intelligence" argument above (no offense to you, Drinky, just an example).

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Cotton Wrote:
I'd probably just drink myself to death. More so, I mean.


"Hey Judas. I know you've made a grave mistake.
Hey Peter. You've been pretty sweet since Easter break."


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:14 pm 
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Stop Breathin' Wrote:
Those who don't believe will always find something, usually including holding themselves superior, to dismiss Christianity.


Christians lead by example then?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:33 pm 
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Stop Breathin' Wrote:
Danny Don't Rapp Wrote:
I think being all openly anti-religion is as annoying as just about anything these days, but at the same time, when I think of adults actually believing in the Christian God and believing the stories in the Bible...well, I'll just say it's moments like these that don't make me think too highly of humanity.



[img][334:500]http://images.rottentomatoes.com/images/movie/gallery/1156566/photo_33_hires.jpg[/img]

"Because I believe in science."


there's no doubt that Danny looks very similar to this.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:48 pm 
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duckyboy Wrote:
Stop Breathin' Wrote:
Those who don't believe will always find something, usually including holding themselves superior, to dismiss Christianity.


Christians lead by example then?


Believe me, sir, I don't count myself superior to much at all.

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because you're empty, and I'm empty

Cotton Wrote:
I'd probably just drink myself to death. More so, I mean.


"Hey Judas. I know you've made a grave mistake.
Hey Peter. You've been pretty sweet since Easter break."


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:13 am 
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duckyboy Wrote:
Stop Breathin' Wrote:
Those who don't believe will always find something, usually including holding themselves superior, to dismiss Christianity.


Christians lead by example then?


supposed to, but rarely do. Its one of the stumbling blocks that people love to put us down about.

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It's Baltimore, gentlemen; the gods will not save you.

Baltimore is a town where everyone thinks they’re normal, but they’re totally insane. In New York, they think they’re crazy, but they’re perfectly normal. --John Waters
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:17 am 
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Flying Rabbit Wrote:
duckyboy Wrote:
Stop Breathin' Wrote:
Those who don't believe will always find something, usually including holding themselves superior, to dismiss Christianity.


Christians lead by example then?


supposed to, but rarely do. Its one of the stumbling blocks that people love to put us down about.


there was a girl i knew that was really into christianity and she did one of the shittiest things i've ever had done to me.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:34 am 
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Atheism has basically become a fucking religion.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:15 am 
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 9:02 am 
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Mick the Stripper Wrote:
Atheism has basically become a fucking religion.


that's only one of its major selling points.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 9:34 am 
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Stop Breathin' Wrote:
Those who don't believe will always find something, usually including holding themselves superior, to dismiss Christianity. See Drano with the "intelligence" argument above (no offense to you, Drinky, just an example).


Wait, what?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 9:55 am 
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You believe a story someone told you when you were little, or you don't.


Gussy it up all you want, but it always comes back to that. And that's ok.

_________________
[quote="Bloor"]He's either done too much and should stay out of the economy, done too little because unemployment isn't 0%, is a dumb ingrate who wasn't ready for the job or a brilliant mastermind who has taken over all aspects of our lives and is transforming us into a Stalinist style penal economy where Christian Whites are fed into meat grinders. Very confusing[/quote]


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 9:59 am 
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Cap'n Squirrgle Wrote:
You believe a story someone told you when you were little, or you don't.


Gussy it up all you want, but it always comes back to that. And that's ok.


a lot of people find Christianity late in life without any correlation to their childhood teachings.

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