Barack Obama, you're a liar.

Yail Bloor · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 10:39 am

Senator Lou Garra Wrote:

Rick Derris Wrote:

The minute it became apparent how bad this was they should've startng fining them 1 Billion a day until it was fixed. (although some reports have a civil fine of more than what that works out to be)

Again, inaction is the problem. SOMEBODY FUCKING DO SOMETHING. Even if it doesn't work, they shoulda been trying this top kill shit from HOUR 1. Not Day 1, HOUR 1.

The only problem with this is that if the Federal government steps in from Day 1 to try and contain something that they don't have the capability of containing (which they don't and why the fuck would they?), then they are responsible 100% and ALL the blame shifts to the Obama Admin. from BP...not to mention it's just one more example of the Big Bad Federal Government undermining private industry (and failing because as I mentioned before, they can't stop it)

Leon · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 11:01 am

I feel like I mostly agree with Yail Bloor on this one. The government makes for a great easy scapegoat. Honestly I think some people must expect the president to be capable of miracles and get disappointed when he isn't. I do very think that the lack of regulation is very much to blame, but hopefully it will get tighter after this, although I wouldn't hold my breath. I do really wish that they would accept help from other countries, or at least have a great explanation about why they aren't.

MontyTheMongoose · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 11:55 am

Yail Bloor Wrote:

Senator Lou Garra Wrote:

Rick Derris Wrote:

The minute it became apparent how bad this was they should've startng fining them 1 Billion a day until it was fixed. (although some reports have a civil fine of more than what that works out to be)

Again, inaction is the problem. SOMEBODY FUCKING DO SOMETHING. Even if it doesn't work, they shoulda been trying this top kill shit from HOUR 1. Not Day 1, HOUR 1.

The only problem with this is that if the Federal government steps in from Day 1 to try and contain something that they don't have the capability of containing (which they don't and why the fuck would they?), then they are responsible 100% and ALL the blame shifts to the Obama Admin. from BP...not to mention it's just one more example of the Big Bad Federal Government undermining private industry (and failing because as I mentioned before, they can't stop it)

"The most dangerous words you could ever hear: Ma'am, I'm from The Government, & I'm here to help".

timmyjoe42 · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 12:09 pm

this shit is epic.

I heard they don't plan to have it contained until the end of August.

Senator LooGAR · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 1:06 pm

Yail Bloor Wrote:

Senator Lou Garra Wrote:

Rick Derris Wrote:

The minute it became apparent how bad this was they should've startng fining them 1 Billion a day until it was fixed. (although some reports have a civil fine of more than what that works out to be)

Again, inaction is the problem. SOMEBODY FUCKING DO SOMETHING. Even if it doesn't work, they shoulda been trying this top kill shit from HOUR 1. Not Day 1, HOUR 1.

The only problem with this is that if the Federal government steps in from Day 1 to try and contain something that they don't have the capability of containing (which they don't and why the fuck would they?), then they are responsible 100% and ALL the blame shifts to the Obama Admin. from BP...not to mention it's just one more example of the Big Bad Federal Government undermining private industry (and failing because as I mentioned before, they can't stop it)

But now they're in the same boat, AND looking like impotent because they can't make BP do anything, and can't do anything themselves.

bort · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 1:38 pm

i agree that fining BP billions is a good idea - in theory. BP would presumably stop the leak and that's a good thing. Or BP would not stop the leak, and the gov't would get some funding to play with. However, I know the president is powerful, but i don't think he can just say "Bam! - One billion dollars." and get it handed over. With all the red tape/legislation/lawyers involved, whatever money that changes hands between BP and those that were effected will probably not be seen until after Obama is out of office.

Senator LooGAR · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 1:55 pm

Yail Bloor Wrote:

Senator Lou Garra Wrote:

Rick Derris Wrote:

The minute it became apparent how bad this was they should've startng fining them 1 Billion a day until it was fixed. (although some reports have a civil fine of more than what that works out to be)

Again, inaction is the problem. SOMEBODY FUCKING DO SOMETHING. Even if it doesn't work, they shoulda been trying this top kill shit from HOUR 1. Not Day 1, HOUR 1.

The only problem with this is that if the Federal government steps in from Day 1 to try and contain something that they don't have the capability of containing (which they don't and why the fuck would they?), then they are responsible 100% and ALL the blame shifts to the Obama Admin. from BP...not to mention it's just one more example of the Big Bad Federal Government undermining private industry (and failing because as I mentioned before, they can't stop it)

Frank Rich proved my point when he Wrote:

We expect him to deliver on this core conviction. But the impact on “the people” of his signature governmental project so far, health care reform, remains provisional and abstract. Like it or not, a pipe gushing poison into an ocean is a visceral crisis demanding visible, immediate action.

Obama’s news conference on Thursday — explaining in detail the government’s response, its mistakes and its precise relationship to BP — was at least three weeks overdue. It was also his first full news conference in 10 months. Obama’s recurrent tardiness in defining exactly what he wants done on a given issue — a lapse also evident in the protracted rollout of the White House’s specific health care priorities — remains baffling, as does his recent avoidance of news conferences. Such diffidence does not convey a J.F.K.-redux in charge of a neo-New Frontier activist government.

Yail Bloor · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 2:19 pm

Quote:

Such diffidence does not convey a J.F.K.-redux in charge of a neo-New Frontier activist government.

This may be the dumbest interpretation of both JFK and Obama's presidency's that I've ever read. To wit, JFK's White House conducted much of it's business in the dark and Barack Obama is a center-left shill for corporations (aka a modern politician). Anything else is either an invention, rewriting history or a mentally cloudy projection.

I'll also still maintain that his only real mistake seems to be not going down there sooner; after seeing Bill Clinton pull that "rush to a tragedy literally minutes after it happens" optic off countless times, I'll never understand why any president wouldn't do the same: I'm looking at you GWB as well as BHO.

Senator LooGAR · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 2:29 pm

Yail Bloor Wrote:

Quote:

Such diffidence does not convey a J.F.K.-redux in charge of a neo-New Frontier activist government.

This may be the dumbest interpretation of both JFK and Obama's presidency's that I've ever read. To wit, JFK's White House conducted much of it's business in the dark and Barack Obama is a center-left shill for corporations (aka a modern politician). Anything else is either an invention, rewriting history or a mentally cloudy projection.

I'll also still maintain that his only real mistake seems to be not going down there sooner; after seeing Bill Clinton pull that "rush to a tragedy literally minutes after it happens" optic off countless times, I'll never understand why any president wouldn't do the same: I'm looking at you GWB as well as BHO.

Except that it was the standard interpretation of his campaign, so like it or not, it is the optical lense through which much of his presidency will be seen. It might not be true, he might not have invited it, but perception is reality.

My only argument is that action is always better than inaction - something Cool Papa Barry needs to learn. People form opinions of events in seconds, don't pay attention to interpretations, and move on with only a generally positive or negative feeling of what happened, truth be damned these days. "A lie runs around the world before the truth can put its shoes on." You're either forming people's opinions for them, or they are forming them about you - not much gray area left.

Cupcakes · **Joined:** Sat Nov 12, 2005 12:04 am **Posts:** 3271

Quote:

You're going to have to explain to me why a "top kill" would result in losing the well.
I would think that you could cap the leak site and then re-drill to access the same deposit from another site.

so can anyone answer this?

Kingfish · **Posted:** Sun May 30, 2010 5:34 pm

Borriquito Wrote:

Quote:

You're going to have to explain to me why a "top kill" would result in losing the well.
I would think that you could cap the leak site and then re-drill to access the same deposit from another site.

so can anyone answer this?

Read oil drum.com or something like that. It will give you all the tech details you care about. Not to be a dick but I really don't care to explain mud flow on a music board. Mostly I trust my best friend's brother who closes wells for a living. Never felt the need to become a petroleum engineer.

saint · **Joined:** Mon Oct 25, 2004 1:28 pm **Posts:** 4271

the dead dolphin photo in the la times made for ghastly brunch reading today. i think i need to stop paying attention to this. it's really getting me down.

Mick · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 10:15 am

I think the problem here isn't the delayed reaction...on the contrary...it could be said that action came too soon, without properly implementing realistic long and short term goals and proper planning to minimise the damage of this thing.

Or maybe it's just an unsolvable problem.

Radcliffe · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 11:54 am

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

Or maybe it's just an unsolvable problem.

I've heard ONE faint scientific voice in the wilderness suggest exactly that. Unsolvable at least until the oil pressure and water pressure somehow cancel each other out. He's either unreliable and a wacko, or he's telling a truth that nobody wants to hear. So far it seems like the latter.

Kingfish · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 1:08 pm

It's going to be awesome when the 1st hurricane sends oil all over the coast.

Kingfish · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 1:11 pm

Radcliffe Wrote:

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

Or maybe it's just an unsolvable problem.

I've heard ONE faint scientific voice in the wilderness suggest exactly that. Unsolvable at least until the oil pressure and water pressure somehow cancel each other out. He's either unreliable and a wacko, or he's telling a truth that nobody wants to hear. So far it seems like the latter.

Right it's insolvable because the crappy answers used so far didn't work.

Kingfish · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 1:14 pm

Mick the Stripper Wrote:

I think the problem here isn't the delayed reaction...on the contrary...it could be said that action came too soon, without properly implementing realistic long and short term goals and proper planning to minimise the damage of this thing.

Or maybe it's just an unsolvable problem.

Here are the short and long term goals: stop the leak.

Yail Bloor · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 2:22 pm

Kingfish Wrote:

It's going to be awesome when the 1st hurricane sends oil all over the coast.

If that happens before I take my wife to the beach, I may have to join the Obner Divorce Club.

Thee Incident · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 2:54 pm

Old college friend flew down from MI to spend three weeks trying to help with the cleanup, got ran around to a Kafka-esque degree and ultimately decided the entire cleanup effort is a useless PR sham at this point.

Here's his blog from the ordeal; http://ericlacy.com/

Kingfish · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 4:31 pm

Thee Incident Wrote:

Old college friend flew down from MI to spend three weeks trying to help with the cleanup, got ran around to a Kafka-esque degree and ultimately decided the entire cleanup effort is a useless PR sham at this point.

Here's his blog from the ordeal; http://ericlacy.com/

It's frustrating. Lots of people locally have had the same problem. Lots of rumors going around about this and other shady stuff. What is fact- the media cannot interview cleanup workers without BP escort.

Thee Incident · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 5:07 pm

Kingfish Wrote:

Thee Incident Wrote:

Old college friend flew down from MI to spend three weeks trying to help with the cleanup, got ran around to a Kafka-esque degree and ultimately decided the entire cleanup effort is a useless PR sham at this point.

Here's his blog from the ordeal; http://ericlacy.com/

It's frustrating. Lots of people locally have had the same problem. Lots of rumors going around about this and other shady stuff. What is fact- the media cannot interview cleanup workers without BP escort.

For now, but I have to think there are myriad blog entries like his that won't be terribly hard to find and use as leads for the media to start putting together the stories that need to get out there. One of them being that this is a Grade-AAA cluster right now and likely will be until the state and federal governments decide to take over coordinating cleanup and mitigation and tell BP "Y'all go home. We'll send you the bill."

Thee Incident · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 5:12 pm

BTW, when I say mitigation I mean on-land/marine relief, including Loog's preferred Arabian super tanker method, the Costner solution or whatever. I still think BP is best equipped to figure out how to cut off the gusher. Problem is, how do you goose them to make it happen as expediently and effectively as possible?

saint · **Joined:** Mon Oct 25, 2004 1:28 pm **Posts:** 4271

well, they are about to saw off the broken pipe which will result in a 20% stronger leak if they don't capture the oil effectively. i'm not too confident that this will work.

Dalen · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 7:52 pm

Just got back into town, and have avoided the news for the past 3 days. I come home and read this shit...

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/05/31/louisi ... tml?hpt=C1

Dalen · **Posted:** Mon May 31, 2010 7:55 pm

also, if you'd like to help out financially, you can trust these folks:

http://www.gnof.org/gulf-coast-oil-spil ... lf-coast//

Barack Obama, you're a liar.

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