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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 6:11 pm 
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I seem to recall (vaguely) reading an interview in which he was asked about the voice thing on this album, and he said he guessed it was because he quit smoking. Unless anyone has doubted it up until now, Bob Dylan has lied about any and every kind of shit, small and large, for EONS. And it never bothered me a bit. Putting out shitty music (some of it deliberately according to him) always bothered the fuck out of me, and there's a string of albums coming up that dive off that cliff.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:52 pm 
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yeah, in about 2 albums we are going to be looking back at this fondly

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:01 pm 
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Smoke
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Really like this album. Like I said earlier, I'll put this on over JWH 8 out of 10 times. The "voice" doesn't bother me at all especially with songs this good.

Was really liking "Threw It All Away" and "Tell Me That It Isn't True" today.

Also, I was looking at who played on this and it appears Charlie Daniels played bass for him on a couple records during this period. I think he was still a Nashville session musician at the time.

Last, does it not speak to the strength of the material that it can be played several different ways (ie- Rolling Thunder) and covered by such varying artists and it still works?


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 1:32 am 
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I really like "Tell Me That It Isn't True" and "Tonight...". Some clunkers but I like this album.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 1:54 am 
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man i fuckin love nashville skyline, it's one of my favorites

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:28 am 
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TEH MACHINE
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Image
Quote:
There has never been a clearer attempt to shed an audience than Self-Portrait. At least, that's one way of looking at this baffling double album, a deliberately sprawling affair that runs the gamut from self-portrait to self-parody, touching on operatic pop, rowdy Basement Tapes leftovers, slight whimsy, and covers of wannabe Dylans from Paul Simon to Gordon Lightfoot. To say the least, it's confusing, especially arriving at the end of a decade of unmitigated brilliance, and while the years have made it easier to listen to, it still remains inscrutable, an impossible record to unlock. It may not be worth the effort, either, since this isn't a matter of deciphering cryptic lyrics or interpreting lyrics, it's all about discerning intent, figuring out what the hell Dylan was thinking when he was recording — not trying to decode a song. There are times where it's quite clearly played for a laugh — if his shambling version of "The Boxer" isn't a pointed parody of Paul Simon, there was no reason to cut it — but he's poker-faced elsewhere, and the songs (apart from such earthed gems as "Mighty Quinn," which aren't presented in their best versions) are simply not worth much consideration. But, in a strange way, Self Portrait is, because decades have passed and it still doesn't make much sense, even for Dylanphiles. That doesn't necessarily mean that it's worth the time to figure it out — you're not going to find an answer, anyway — but it's sort of fascinating all the same.

Code:
pt 1 - http://tinyurl.com/26uyncx
pt 2 - http://tinyurl.com/29p76yo

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:12 am 
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As big a turd as has ever been dropped. Never made it all the way through this abomination, and have no intention of changing that now.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:53 am 
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It's amazing how many times I almost bought this record used back in the day when all of my non booze/dope discretionary income went to buying used cd's. Safe to say I dodged a major bullet.

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:59 am 
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Gayford R. Tincture

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I may jump on board just for this one. I've never heard it.

Any chance of getting pt. 2 uploaded somewhere besides Rapidshare? It's a real bitch about not allowing back-to-back downloads.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:16 am 
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TEH MACHINE
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Drinky Wrote:
I may jump on board just for this one. I've never heard it.

Any chance of getting pt. 2 uploaded somewhere besides Rapidshare? It's a real bitch about not allowing back-to-back downloads.

Code:
http://www.mediafire.com/?skcnoly1yf5az9b

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:27 am 
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TEH MACHINE
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This is just fantastically terrible. If it was a calculated attempt to destroy his reputation, then there is simply nothing Dylan cannot do. It was like his suggestion to the generation he spoke to, "hey, it's 1970 now, let me show you how to truly disappoint everyone around you."

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:30 am 
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Gayford R. Tincture

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Thanks, man. Can't help but be morbidly curious about this.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:25 am 
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I'm not going to actually try to defend this album, though i do like an ok number of songs, but while i wouldn't call it a good album, i do think it gets treated unfairly.

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:00 pm 
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Smoke
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My first time ever listening to this album. Certainly a strange brew of shit stew going on here but like DJ said, fantastically terrible.

I found this article that's a pretty interesting take on it. The guy clearly has Dylan on a pedestal but it does sound like some shenanigans were going on. But, it could just be Dylan fucking with everyone:


Quote:
So…will the real Bob Dylan please stand up?

Or, better yet, sit out.

To understand “Self-Portrait,” you have to understand where Dylan was at this point in his life and career. Having created such an impressive body of work, he was saddled with the baggage that comes with straddling the cusp between man and myth. When people are gaining notoriety for simply rifling through your trash for “clues,” you’ve officially got problems.

Here’s Dylan in 1984 again:

This was just about the time of that Woodstock festival, which was the sum total of all this bullshit. And it seemed to have something to do with me, this Woodstock Nation, and everything it represented. So we couldn’t breathe. I couldn’t get any space for myself and my family, and there was no help, nowhere. I got very resentful about the whole thing…There’d be crowds outside my house. And I said, ‘Well, fuck it. I wish these people would just forget about me. I wanna do something they can’t possibly like, they can’t relate to. They’ll see it, and they’ll listen, and they’ll say, ‘Well, let’s get on to the next person. He ain’t sayin’ it no more.’


Of course, it wouldn’t be Bob Dylan if there weren’t also indications that contradicted the idea as “SP”-as-joke. For example, in Anthony Scaduto’s 1971 bio “Bob Dylan: An Intimate Biography“, Dylan says flat-out: “It’s a great album. There’s a lot of damn good music there. People just didn’t listen at first.”

This kind of kaleidoscopic reasoning may strike some as endlessly aggravating, but back in 1970 Dylan was laying the groundwork for the mercurial, you-can’t-catch-me approach that artists like Eminem later took, defying their audience to peg them down with each turn of phrase. To a true artist, this is a crucial step – not just donning a series of costumes, a la Bowie, but confounding expectations to a point where all that one has worked for is potentially razed to nothing, to be built back up from scratch. Forget aesthetic truth, this seems like an imperative to the maintenance of sanity when a level of fame like Dylan’s is taken into consideration. If he’s not one step ahead, if he just doles out all the answers like a good little monkey, we will swallow him whole, given half a chance.

Thus, ”Self-Portrait” is as crucial and important a record as “Blonde On Blonde.” The latter built the house, and the former knocked it down. And “New Morning” was, well…a new morning. Those with discerning taste know all too well the difference between “good-bad” and “bad-bad.”

In a 2005 interview, Dylan said, “Well my wife and kids and me would sit around after supper on a Saturday night, and we’d all put ideas into a hat. I picked a slip of paper out of the hat, and that would be the week’s activity. One time it might be to get myself photographed at the Western Wall so people would think I was a Zionist. Another time it might be to get a job pumpin’ gas in Paramus, New Jersey, so the press would report I was crazy, or a sicko, or a Mormon.”

On the week of August 31, 1969 , Dylan seems to have pulled a particularly interesting slip of paper out of the hat. I’m guessing it read “Desecrate the classics.” The “Self-Portrait” version of “Like A Rolling Stone,” in particular, truly captures an artist setting fire to his muse. It’s in this deflation of his biggest classic that the album is best captured in miniature. Only three short years after utilizing the provocation of the notorious “Judas!” heckler to reach celestial heights with the same tune, backed by the same Band, Dylan reclaims “Rolling Stone” as his possession fully, to do with what he will. Whether that means bestowing upon us the incendiary fulfillment of rock’s potential, or mischievously scrawling moustaches on his own Mona Lisa, it’s a decision that is only Dylan’s to make. Here, he’s bringing it all back home, all right. He drives the song into the ground, underscoring the valid point that if an artist can create a masterpiece, it should be entirely up to him to fuck it up if he should so desire. What better way for mojo to be recycled back into the canon of artistic creation than to create fertilizer out of it?

P.S. Even stranger than anything involving the actual “Self-Portrait” is the fact that there’s another album called “Dylan” that’s actually partially composed of “Self-Portrait” outtakes! That’s like taking out your trash, deciding it stinks way too bad to be placed with the rest of your garbage, and finding a whole new dumpster in which to throw it away.

The story goes that Columbia released “Dylan” in 1973 as a revenge tactic after Bob changed labels.

But me? I’d like to think it was Dylan’s decision.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:06 pm 
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Gayford R. Tincture

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Rick Derris Wrote:
Quote:
So…will the real Bob Dylan please stand up?
This kind of kaleidoscopic reasoning may strike some as endlessly aggravating, but back in 1970 Dylan was laying the groundwork for the mercurial, you-can’t-catch-me approach that artists like Eminem later took, defying their audience to peg them down with each turn of phrase.


Thank you, Bob Dylan!


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:12 pm 
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This version of "Like A Rolling Stone" is epically bad.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:14 pm 
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TEH MACHINE
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Drinky Wrote:
Rick Derris Wrote:
Quote:
So…will the real Bob Dylan please stand up?
This kind of kaleidoscopic reasoning may strike some as endlessly aggravating, but back in 1970 Dylan was laying the groundwork for the mercurial, you-can’t-catch-me approach that artists like Eminem later took, defying their audience to peg them down with each turn of phrase.


Thank you, Bob Dylan!


That instantly enraged me. Of all the fucking artists to mention, he drops the hip-hop equivalent of Weird Al.

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:15 pm 
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TEH MACHINE
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Rick Derris Wrote:
This version of "Like A Rolling Stone" is epically bad.


Yeah, no kidding. I dumped hot coffee on my hands to distract myself.

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:18 pm 
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Gayford R. Tincture

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DumpJack Wrote:
Drinky Wrote:
Rick Derris Wrote:
Quote:
So…will the real Bob Dylan please stand up?
This kind of kaleidoscopic reasoning may strike some as endlessly aggravating, but back in 1970 Dylan was laying the groundwork for the mercurial, you-can’t-catch-me approach that artists like Eminem later took, defying their audience to peg them down with each turn of phrase.


Thank you, Bob Dylan!


That instantly enraged me. Of all the fucking artists to mention, he drops the hip-hop equivalent of Weird Al.


It was too ridiculous to enrage me. Funny how writers can humiliatingly date themselves like this.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:19 pm 
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I'm definitely in the awesomely terrible category. It's not really Bob. There's a lot of Bob channeling Elvis and making fun of "Next Dylans"

Most of it does not work on a "Robert Zimmerman is God" level, but it is certainly not worthy of utter disdain.

This is the sort of album Derris and I would put on in a group of people for shock and disgust - "We're gonna listen to shit even WE don't like."

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:22 pm 
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DumpJack Wrote:
Rick Derris Wrote:
This version of "Like A Rolling Stone" is epically bad.


Yeah, no kidding. I dumped hot coffee on my hands to distract myself.



But then "Copper Kettle" comes next. I can't decide if this is incredible or if it is great compared to the other songs of the album it happens to be on.

I'm thinking the former.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 1:22 pm 
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DumpJack Wrote:
If it was a calculated attempt to destroy his reputation

I don't buy this notion that Dylan calculated anything. For whatever reason, people like to hear bad Dylan and assume that it's Dylan intentionally trying to be bad, as if good and bad were a switch on a circuit board. If that switch exists, it's fairly curious that he's had it set to OFF for 40 years.


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:56 pm 
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Radcliffe Wrote:
DumpJack Wrote:
If it was a calculated attempt to destroy his reputation

I don't buy this notion that Dylan calculated anything. For whatever reason, people like to hear bad Dylan and assume that it's Dylan intentionally trying to be bad, as if good and bad were a switch on a circuit board. If that switch exists, it's fairly curious that he's had it set to OFF for 40 years.


I don't disagree; I realize that's part of the mythology and was only mentioning it in passing. It may very well be that embracing Christianity DOES destroy the soul.

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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:10 pm 
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I've never known any sort of back story with this album and listened to it for the first time today.

Just based solely on the music, i think it feels like he went into his closet and purged a bunch of shit and just put it out there. It just feels like an odds and sods collection that has some overlooked gems and some downright embarrassing ones.

File Under: Mostly inessential but worth it for die-hards


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 Post subject: Re: The DJ and Gar Saga Continues-The Bob Dylan listening thread
PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:50 pm 
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Of course it was intentional. Of course he wanted to smash the myth and move on. Of course he wanted to shed the faithful. He shed me for sure. I thought "Bob Dylan" was over. I never need to hear this load of crap again.

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